[Greenbuilding] Abandoned mine turned into a pumped storage system...

[John Salmen]

It seems to be turning into the sto-wars. Solyndria (sp?) and beacon have
bankrupted and not because of valid technology but because of access to
market and profitability. Makes you wonder if these start-ups are a
sacrificial way for utilities to develop technology without investment. We
will not see significant shift to renewables (solar, wind) without storage.
Hydoelectric pumped storage is basically existing technology (dates from the
30's) utilities are familiar with so the obvious short term solution
regardless of the 1/3 energy penalty and despite the fact that it really is
just putting an archaic infrastructure on top of an archaic infrastructure
or heating an uninsulated house with an efficient heatpump.

The biggest concerns with any hydro project are environmental site concerns
and there is little research on closed (buried) systems. Given that there is
no such thing as a closed environment there is effect on groundwater and
that is part of the limnology of the area and everything visible. As we rush
into storage needs (eu especially) there will be increasing pressure to
invest in and be stuck with hydro as opposed to more benign technologies


-----Original Message-----
From: Greenbuilding [mailto:greenbuilding-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org]
On Behalf Of John Straube
Sent: February-23-13 3:28 PM
To: Green Building
Subject: Re: [Greenbuilding] Abandoned mine turned into a pumped storage
system...

I too would keep an open mind on this.  Pumped storage has a round trip
efficiency far less than 100%, but then so do all storage methods.  Even if
we can get 75%, that is a good deal as we often have, and likely will in
future have more, low-cost renewable energy generated that can be used at
the same time.  Large scale storage of some sort seems like a decent option.

On 2013-02-23, at 3:31 PM, Gordon Howell -- Howell Mayhew Engineering
<ghowell at hme.ca> wrote:

> Hello Rob:
> 
> I'd be interested in your comments about why you think it is a
greenwashing scam.
> 
> Note that the headline says "5x the size", but the article says "5x the
height"... its a big difference and then adds "though with a fraction of the
volume".
> 
> +Gordon Howell, P.Eng.
> Edmonton
> 
> From: RT <archilogic at yahoo.ca>
> Subject: [Greenbuilding] Greenwashing Mega-scam(s)
> 
> Don't ask me why 'cuz I don't know but the "CFL bulbs/mercury" thread made
me think of a story I saw this week about an initiative to redevelop a
former open pit mine (owned/operated by Bethlehem Steel, in Southeastern
Ontario to turn it into a "storage battery five times the size of Niagara
Falls".
> 
> http://tinyurl.com/a8u2gl4
> 
> 
> This "storage battery from open pit mine hole" hasn't yet been 
> implemented but I wouldn't be surprised if it too is allowed to proceed.
> 
> --
> === * ===
> Rob Tom
> Kanata, Ontario, Canada
> 
> 
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John Straube
www.JohnStraube.com


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