[Stoves] Stoves Digest, Vol 12, Issue 13

Anand Karve adkarve at gmail.com
Mon Aug 8 20:54:54 PDT 2011


Dear stovers,
I am quite sure that glycerine can be used as feedstock in a biogas plant.
Yours
A.D.Karve

On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 6:07 PM, IPC <ipcipc at mweb.co.za> wrote:
> @Crispin Message: 4 Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 23:40:34 -0400
>
> Glycerine is a glut on the market because it is ~50% of the plant carbon
> that goes into biodiesel. It doesn't burn very well at all and is
> hygroscopic to boot.  However, I found some recent work that it can be used
> directly as diesel fuel with minor mods to the engine to preheat the air.
> It's rather low energy, but for a cheap waste fuel that's no drawback.
>
> Prof Philip Lloyd
> Energy Institute
> Cape Peninsula University of Technology
> PO Box 652, Cape Town 8000
> Tel:021 460 4216
> Fax:021 460 3828
> Cell: 083 441 5247
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org
> [mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org] On Behalf Of
> stoves-request at lists.bioenergylists.org
> Sent: 08 August 2011 06:52
> To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> Subject: Stoves Digest, Vol 12, Issue 13
>
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> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. Re: Jatropha and its future (Fireside Hearth)
>   2. Re: Jatropha and its future (Anand Karve)
>   3. Re: Jatropha and its future (Crispin Pemberton-Pigott)
>   4. Re: Jatropha and its future (Crispin Pemberton-Pigott)
>   5. Re: Jatropha and its future (Fireside Hearth)
>   6. Re: Chimney Chula (Crispin Pemberton-Pigott)
>   7. Re: Jatropha and its future (Crispin Pemberton-Pigott)
>   8. Re: Jatropha and its future (Anand Karve)
>   9. Re: institutional rocket stoves (Larry Winiarski)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 13:23:00 -0700
> From: Fireside Hearth <firesidehearthvashon at hotmail.com>
> To: <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Jatropha and its future
> Message-ID: <blu125-w323673D36BDC4E2F10E23C33E0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
>
>
> Interesting idea........Are the any records kept on how cleanly and or how
> much maintenance might be involved. Example.....corn feed stoves have allot
> of klinkering due to the sugar content if I understand correctly. We might
> be able to utilize more of these fuels than I realize at this point as I
> have not had enough time to test these things out. Our focus has had to stay
> more narrow than I would like due to the "business side" of our growth. I
> did for a while mess with burning Glycerine from bio diesel manufacturing.
> Althoe I have not dismissed this avenue I do feel it is a messy process. The
> glycerine heats up and "melts" much like paraffin wax and could become a
> fire hazard. I am interested as I am coming to a point of less business and
> more inventing to try alternative fuel sources......any ideas???
> Thank you R&B
>
> From: crispinpigott at gmail.com
> To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 14:36:59 -0400
> Subject: [Stoves] Jatropha and its future
>
>
>
> Dear FriendsI am not sure how many stove are being worked on as Jatropha
> seed or oil or cake burners, but my understanding was the main thrust was to
> put to use some of the leftovers from biofuel production, especially that
> was the focus in Tanzania.It seems those farmers who invested in Jatropha
> production lost about $65 per ha
> http://pubs.acs.org/doi/full/10.1021/es201943v so my question is whether or
> not there is much point in working on (perhaps) whole seed stoves. Perhaps
> if the J-oil industry suffers a quick death there will still be a meaningful
> supply of oily seed fuel that  can be burned relatively easily with a decent
> performance and controllability. At least until they go back to sunflower
> which looks a lot more promising.Has anyone made a sunflower seed burning
> stove? The oil runs up to 49% on some varieties.Always looking for new
> ideas?RegardsCrispin _______________________________________________
> Stoves mailing list
>
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>
> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves,  News and Information see our web site:
> http://www.bioenergylists.org/
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2011 11:28:33 +0800
> From: Anand Karve <adkarve at gmail.com>
> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
>        <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Jatropha and its future
> Message-ID:
>        <CACPy7SesHn=NWOpzsxUrmfO9hpA+BSbCNO7gh-HPK1L00UPQiQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
>
> Dear Crispin,
> we have in India castor hybrids that can yield upto 5 tons of seed or
> 2.5 ton oil per ha. Only Malaysian oil palm can outyield hybrid castor.
> Castor oil acts as a purgative if one gulps it directly, but if used in
> cooking or frying, whereby it gets mixed with other type of food, it loses
> its purgative effect and it is digested by the human system like any other
> vegetable oil. Castor oilcake is however highly toxic because of the
> presence of ricin in it, but it is a great feedstock for producing biogas.
> Yours
> A.D.Karve
>
> On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 2:36 AM, Crispin Pemberton-Pigott
> <crispinpigott at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Dear Friends
>>
>> I am not sure how many stove are being worked on as Jatropha seed or
>> oil or cake burners, but my understanding was the main thrust was to
>> put to use some of the leftovers from biofuel production, especially
>> that was the focus in Tanzania.
>>
>> It seems those farmers who invested in Jatropha production lost about
>> $65 per ha http://pubs.acs.org/doi/full/10.1021/es201943v so my
>> question is whether or not there is much point in working on (perhaps)
>> whole seed stoves. Perhaps if the J-oil industry suffers a quick death
>> there will still be a meaningful supply of oily seed fuel that? can be
>> burned relatively easily with a decent performance and
>> controllability. At least until they go back to sunflower which looks a
> lot more promising.
>>
>> Has anyone made a sunflower seed burning stove? The oil runs up to 49%
>> on some varieties.
>>
>> Always looking for new ideas?
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Crispin
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Stoves mailing list
>>
>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
>>
>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenerg
>> ylists.org
>>
>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, ?News and Information see our web site:
>> http://www.bioenergylists.org/
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> ***
> Dr. A.D. Karve
> President, Appropriate Rural Technology Institute (ARTI)
>
> *Please change my email address in your records to: adkarve at gmail.com *
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 23:33:28 -0400
> From: "Crispin Pemberton-Pigott" <crispinpigott at gmail.com>
> To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'"
>        <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Jatropha and its future
> Message-ID: <112c01cc557b$f11bc890$d35359b0$@gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"
>
> Dear Dr AD
>
> I was under the impression that the castor oil had to be de-toxified at some
> level. There is a product called Covo Oil, a castor cooking oil, that has
> been treated, we were told. Not so?
>
> Interesting. The article I linked says in a couple of places that Jatropha
> has not been 'domesticated' with the result that the yields are erratic.
> Strange, that.
>
> I can't think of anything close to those oil yields. The best I know of for
> sunflower is 49% variety but it is not a high mass one.  The heavier
> yielding have 47% so more total oil but still, 2 tons would be good on dry
> land.
>
> I take it that the castor is not irrigated, correct?
>
> The cake is 50% of the crop so 2.5 tons gives how much biogas? And how much
> 'leftovers'?
>
> Thanks
> Crispin
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> Dear Crispin,
> we have in India castor hybrids that can yield upto 5 tons of seed or
> 2.5 ton oil per ha. Only Malaysian oil palm can outyield hybrid castor.
> Castor oil acts as a purgative if one gulps it directly, but if used in
> cooking or frying, whereby it gets mixed with other type of food, it loses
> its purgative effect and it is digested by the human system like any other
> vegetable oil. Castor oilcake is however highly toxic because of the
> presence of ricin in it, but it is a great feedstock for producing biogas.
> Yours
> A.D.Karve
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 23:40:34 -0400
> From: "Crispin Pemberton-Pigott" <crispinpigott at gmail.com>
> To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'"
>        <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Jatropha and its future
> Message-ID: <112d01cc557c$eeb6ba00$cc242e00$@gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Dear Roger
>
>
>
> Alex English can comment on the corn burning, but I think it is from ash
> melting that you get the clinkering. Sugar burns really well at a low
> temperature.
>
>
>
> With all crops, there are many tons that are spoiled for various reasons.
> Therefore there is always a market for them. Aflatoxin (and zearalanone)
> contamination is a problem in some countries and it would be good if it were
> burned rather than fed to slightly more tolerant animals. That stuff is bad
> news.
>
>
>
> Mouldy maize is usually mixed with good maize to meet some local standard
> but still, there is a lot that can't be used for food or feed. So, into the
> fire. Rancid grains, rotten wheat, mouldy oats - we should turn them into
> fuel as it is biomass and already pelletized!
>
>
>
> The advantage of using glycerine is that it doesn't spill well and kids are
> unlikely to drink it. Like gelled alcohol, it melts at just the right
> temperature and could me a good fuel. Could you get a smell-less burn? That
> would be an indication the burn was good for a start.
>
>
>
> There is a wax burning stove developed in South Africa and Sasol (Sasolwax
> in an earlier name) was interested in it generally, and developing their own
> stove commercially, which I have never seen in the wild. There is a lot of
> leftover wax from various industrial processes, just as there are many
> alcohols left over from sugar making - like 100 types! Into the fire!
>
>
>
> Regards
>
> Crispin
>
>
>
>
>
> ++++
>
> Interesting idea........Are the any records kept on how cleanly and or how
> much maintenance might be involved. Example.....corn feed stoves have allot
> of klinkering due to the sugar content if I understand correctly. We might
> be able to utilize more of these fuels than I realize at this point as I
> have not had enough time to test these things out. Our focus has had to stay
> more narrow than I would like due to the "business side" of our growth. I
> did for a while mess with burning Glycerine from bio diesel manufacturing.
> Althoe I have not dismissed this avenue I do feel it is a messy process. The
> glycerine heats up and "melts" much like paraffin wax and could become a
> fire hazard. I am interested as I am coming to a point of less business and
> more inventing to try alternative fuel sources......any ideas???
> Thank you R&B
>
>  _____
>
> From: crispinpigott at gmail.com
> To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 14:36:59 -0400
> Subject: [Stoves] Jatropha and its future
>
> Dear Friends
>
> I am not sure how many stove are being worked on as Jatropha seed or oil or
> cake burners, but my understanding was the main thrust was to put to use
> some of the leftovers from biofuel production, especially that was the focus
> in Tanzania.
>
> It seems those farmers who invested in Jatropha production lost about $65
> per ha http://pubs.acs.org/doi/full/10.1021/es201943v so my question is
> whether or not there is much point in working on (perhaps) whole seed
> stoves. Perhaps if the J-oil industry suffers a quick death there will still
> be a meaningful supply of oily seed fuel that  can be burned relatively
> easily with a decent performance and controllability. At least until they go
> back to sunflower which looks a lot more promising.
>
> Has anyone made a sunflower seed burning stove? The oil runs up to 49% on
> some varieties.
>
> Always looking for new ideas.
>
> Regards
>
> Crispin
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________ Stoves mailing list to Send
> a Message to the list, use the email address stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists
> .org for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> http://www.bioenergylists.org/
>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 21:19:48 -0700
> From: Fireside Hearth <firesidehearthvashon at hotmail.com>
> To: <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Jatropha and its future
> Message-ID: <BLU125-W6CB7441F49D537DFA9F0AC3210 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
>
>
>    Thank you Crispin....
>
>             These are all great ideas! Do you have any gut level sense of
> what downsides there could be with regard to emission? would I find these to
> be "fairly clean" fuel options? The glycerine did produce a scent/smoke free
> burn once temperatures got high enough, however getting there was both
> smelly and irritating. My delivery system I believe will need to advance to
> (possibly) a fuel injector, unless something less complicated (oil drip) can
> be thought up with any reliability. I actually started this project as a
> pellet stove with a simple 12 volt auger and timing block system. I could go
> back to that to push grains, seeds, or pitts....even dung! The electrical
> demand would be covered by solar, and at some time I wish to experiment
> further with thermocoupling the stove for a truly off grid, self powered
> pellet stove. I am saving these posts which get me thinking so once my
> current project is underway I can revisit them. With the level of expertise
> represented here many  things are exciting possibilities......this is one
> e-mail I will save for the near future and look for more information on as I
> develop new ideas. Thank you very much.
> Roger
>
> From: crispinpigott at gmail.com
> To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 23:40:34 -0400
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Jatropha and its future
>
>
>
> Dear Roger Alex English can comment on the corn burning, but I think it is
> from ash melting that you get the clinkering. Sugar burns really well at a
> low temperature. With all crops, there are many tons that are spoiled for
> various reasons. Therefore there is always a market for them. Aflatoxin (and
> zearalanone) contamination is a problem in some countries and it would be
> good if it were burned rather than fed to slightly more tolerant animals.
> That stuff is bad news.  Mouldy maize is usually mixed with good maize to
> meet some local standard but still, there is a lot that can?t be used for
> food or feed. So, into the fire. Rancid grains, rotten wheat, mouldy oats ?
> we should turn them into fuel as it is biomass and already pelletized! The
> advantage of using glycerine is that it doesn?t spill well and kids are
> unlikely to drink it. Like gelled alcohol, it melts at just the right
> temperature and could me a good fuel. Could you get a smell-less burn? That
> would be an indication the burn was good for a start. There is a wax burning
> stove developed in South Africa and Sasol (Sasolwax in an earlier name) was
> interested in it generally, and developing their own stove commercially,
> which I have never seen in the wild. There is a lot of leftover wax from
> various industrial processes, just as there are many alcohols left over from
> sugar making ? like 100 types! Into the fire! RegardsCrispin
> ++++Interesting idea........Are the any records kept on how cleanly and or
> how much maintenance might be involved. Example.....corn feed stoves have
> allot of klinkering due to the sugar content if I understand correctly. We
> might be able to utilize more of these fuels than I realize at this point as
> I have not had enough time to test these things out. Our focus has had to
> stay more narrow than I would like due to the "business side" of our growth.
> I did for a while mess with burning Glycerine from bio diesel manufacturing.
> Althoe I have not dismissed this avenue I do feel it is a messy process. The
> glycerine heats up and "melts" much like paraffin wax and could become a
> fire hazard. I am interested as I am coming to a point of less business and
> more inventing to try alternative fuel sources......any ideas???
> Thank you R&B  From: crispinpigott at gmail.com
> To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 14:36:59 -0400
> Subject: [Stoves] Jatropha and its futureDear FriendsI am not sure how many
> stove are being worked on as Jatropha seed or oil or cake burners, but my
> understanding was the main thrust was to put to use some of the leftovers
> from biofuel production, especially that was the focus in Tanzania.It seems
> those farmers who invested in Jatropha production lost about $65 per ha
> http://pubs.acs.org/doi/full/10.1021/es201943v so my question is whether or
> not there is much point in working on (perhaps) whole seed stoves. Perhaps
> if the J-oil industry suffers a quick death there will still be a meaningful
> supply of oily seed fuel that  can be burned relatively easily with a decent
> performance and controllability. At least until they go back to sunflower
> which looks a lot more promising.Has anyone made a sunflower seed burning
> stove? The oil runs up to 49% on some varieties.Always looking for new
> ideas?RegardsCrispin _______________________________________________ Stoves
> mailing list to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings
> use the web page
> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists
> .org for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> http://www.bioenergylists.org/
> _______________________________________________
> Stoves mailing list
>
> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
>
> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists
> .org
>
> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves,  News and Information see our web site:
> http://www.bioenergylists.org/
> -------------- next part --------------
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> URL:
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> ttachments/20110807/75eb9026/attachment-0001.html>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2011 00:25:21 -0400
> From: "Crispin Pemberton-Pigott" <crispinpigott at gmail.com>
> To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'"
>        <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Chimney Chula
> Message-ID: <114d01cc5583$3108d180$931a7480$@gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"
>
> Dear Xavier
>
>>Do you know any stove or any way to build a stove which would be small,
> even if it needs to deliver high power to cook on big pots?
>
> You can build the stove to one side and pipe the hot gases into the side and
> under the pot, exiting on the other side into a chimney. This, in essence,
> is what the modified Mongolian coal stoves do when heating water (for space
> heating).
>
> Cooking height is very important to many cultures. Fan stoves hold a lot of
> promise getting the height down because you are able to produce a compact,
> intense flame.
>
>>Have you faced user acceptance issues because of the stove size ?
>
> Nearly all stoves developers working in India have been facing that
> challenge. It seems to be a bigger problem there than in many other places
> which are more interested in looks, power and 'pride of ownership'.
>
> Many really inexpensive stoves are short because they are simple and don't
> have much flame space, and they use little material, but they could often be
> shortened further.
>
> The JIKO is not as short as it could be - it only needs a small amount of
> space for ash and air under the grate. Fashion is probably has as much to do
> with it as blindly imitating our fathers.
>
> Regards
> Crispin
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2011 00:35:46 -0400
> From: "Crispin Pemberton-Pigott" <crispinpigott at gmail.com>
> To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'"
>        <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Jatropha and its future
> Message-ID: <115401cc5584$a5b86170$f1292450$@gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Dear Roger
>
>
>
> The glycerine-as-fuel is interesting. There is a lot of glycerine produced
> in the oil pumping business - it sticks to the inside of the pipes. What
> happen to it these days? Vaseline was developed to get rid of it at a
> profit!
>
>
>
> If it is cheap (might not be) it can be 'canned' like ethanol gel. Ethanol
> does not have a very high heat content (hence the poor mileage cars
> currently get compared with real gasoline). Watered-down ethanol is pretty
> crummy. James Robinson at the SeTAR Centre has seem some at 18 MJ/Litre or
> even less. Prof Philip Lloyd was running a stove on a fuel that had so much
> water in it, it was condensing on the underside of the pot and dripped so
> much it extinguished the fire!! Ha ha!
>
>
>
> So what is the heat content of glycerine? How much does it cost? Where does
> it come from? Is there much available? What is the melting temperature?
>
>
>
> Philip: what is the vapour pressure and so on? Have you ever tried burning
> it? [Philip reads this list.]
>
>
>
> Most alcohol burning stoves are terrible - that is my biased assessment.
> They are usually choked to death near the evaporation zone and have very
> short flame spaces, followed by too much air supply, yielding a smelly burn
> - smelling like partly burned gel compound. We test quite a number of them.
> There is a belief that if the fuel is ethanol, the emissions are inherently
> low, which is not true. The emissions are potentially low because the fuel
> is usually pretty good, but emissions are produced by the stove+fuel
> combination. If the burner is poorly constructed, it's gonna smell.
>
>
>
> You know those little pots of flame under the vegetables at the restaurant
> buffet? Terrible combustion efficiency. Lotsa CO.
>
>
>
> Regards
>
> Crispin
>
>
>
>
>
> From: stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org
> [mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org] On Behalf Of Fireside
> Hearth
> Sent: 08 August 2011 00:20
> To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Jatropha and its future
>
>
>
>    Thank you Crispin....
>
>             These are all great ideas! Do you have any gut level sense of
> what downsides there could be with regard to emission? would I find these to
> be "fairly clean" fuel options? The glycerine did produce a scent/smoke free
> burn once temperatures got high enough, however getting there was both
> smelly and irritating. My delivery system I believe will need to advance to
> (possibly) a fuel injector, unless something less complicated (oil drip) can
> be thought up with any reliability. I actually started this project as a
> pellet stove with a simple 12 volt auger and timing block system. I could go
> back to that to push grains, seeds, or pitts....even dung! The electrical
> demand would be covered by solar, and at some time I wish to experiment
> further with thermocoupling the stove for a truly off grid, self powered
> pellet stove. I am saving these posts which get me thinking so once my
> current project is underway I can revisit them. With the level of expertise
> represented here many  things are exciting possibilities......this is one
> e-mail I will save for the near future and look for more information on as I
> develop new ideas. Thank you very much.
> Roger
>
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2011 12:44:46 +0800
> From: Anand Karve <adkarve at gmail.com>
> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
>        <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Jatropha and its future
> Message-ID:
>        <CACPy7SfNLoXaDuCHCHHqYZWkPFXrV0p5h6r+wjrvrXMdCKyqKQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Dear Crispin,
> Because of lack of plant breeding input, Jatropha yields only about 1 ton
> seed per ha and the oil % in the seed is only 30%. Indian farmers had been
> growing castor for at least 2000 years, and they have conducted a lot of
> selection and breeding to develop many high yielding varieties. The main
> ingredient of castor oil is ricinoleic acid, which irritates the mucous
> membranes of the stomach and intestine, which then secrete fluids to wash
> the irritation off. That is the reason of the purgative effect. If castor
> oil is mixed with other food, the ricinoleic acid is diluted and owing to
> longer residence time in the stomach and intestine, it gets digested. Castor
> oil cake gets completely digested in the biogas plant and all of it gets
> converted into biogas. I do not have reliable figures, but I think that 1 kg
> of castor oil cake would yield about 1000 litres biogas.
> Yours
> A.D.Karve
>
> On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 11:33 AM, Crispin Pemberton-Pigott
> <crispinpigott at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Dear Dr AD
>>
>> I was under the impression that the castor oil had to be de-toxified
>> at some level. There is a product called Covo Oil, a castor cooking
>> oil, that has been treated, we were told. Not so?
>>
>> Interesting. The article I linked says in a couple of places that
>> Jatropha has not been 'domesticated' with the result that the yields are
> erratic.
>> Strange, that.
>>
>> I can't think of anything close to those oil yields. The best I know
>> of for sunflower is 49% variety but it is not a high mass one. ?The
>> heavier yielding have 47% so more total oil but still, 2 tons would be
>> good on dry land.
>>
>> I take it that the castor is not irrigated, correct?
>>
>> The cake is 50% of the crop so 2.5 tons gives how much biogas? And how
>> much 'leftovers'?
>>
>> Thanks
>> Crispin
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>>
>> Dear Crispin,
>> we have in India castor hybrids that can yield upto 5 tons of seed or
>> 2.5 ton oil per ha. Only Malaysian oil palm can outyield hybrid castor.
>> Castor oil acts as a purgative if one gulps it directly, but if used
>> in cooking or frying, whereby it gets mixed with other type of food,
>> it loses its purgative effect and it is digested by the human system
>> like any other vegetable oil. Castor oilcake is however highly toxic
>> because of the presence of ricin in it, but it is a great feedstock for
> producing biogas.
>> Yours
>> A.D.Karve
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Stoves mailing list
>>
>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
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>>
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>> ylists.org
>>
>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, ?News and Information see our web site:
>> http://www.bioenergylists.org/
>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> ***
> Dr. A.D. Karve
> President, Appropriate Rural Technology Institute (ARTI)
>
> *Please change my email address in your records to: adkarve at gmail.com *
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 21:55:26 -0700
> From: "Larry Winiarski" <larryw at gotsky.com>
> To: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves"
>        <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] institutional rocket stoves
> Message-ID: <4324D3276D584812B9385E99B781F060 at larryspc>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>        reply-type=original
>
> Dear Xavier
>
> Sometimes , where they have dirt floor, I sink part of the institutional
> rocket stove into the ground and use  a sloped feed or vertical feed . In
> thedown feed,  the combustion camber is then J shaped rather then L shaped
> and I use a horizontal tile or brick to hold up the sticks and control the
> air gap so that the air goes down the sticks to cool them and blow the
> flames into the tunnel. One can also dig a short trench in fron of the
> sticks and use a moveable big brick or block to hold the sticks vertical.
> One can also take this block out of the way and feed the sticks horizontal
> or clean out the ash.
>
> God Bless
>
> Larry Winiarski
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Xavier Brandao" <xvr.brandao at gmail.com>
> To: <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2011 5:18 AM
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Chimney Chula
>
>
>> Crispin and stovers,
>>
>> "An advantage (for India) is the very low cooking height": I think it is
>> not
>> only for India, we are facing this question at the moment in Benin. We
>> made
>> an institutional rocket stove for the restaurant of the main university.
>> They are testing it at the moment, if they like it, all universities in
>> Benin could have these stoves. The first thing the cooks said when they
>> saw
>> the stove was : "it is too high". Men and women in South-Benin are rather
>> short-sized. The stoves they use traditionally are very short. They can
>> stand up, using a big spoon with a long handle.
>> We got this remark from other places, but people accepted, liked and used
>> the stoves anyway. But it is the first time we get such "strong"
>> criticism,
>> almost opposition. I said they would have to try it for a week or more,
>> and
>> then give us their remarks. End-users of the equipment often fear they
>> will
>> be imposed decision by people working above them and sitting in office.
>>
>> The rocket stove combustion chamber grows with the pot size. So does the
>> pot
>> skirt. In the restaurant, they use only 50 kilos round pots, the biggest
>> ones I have ever seen. The stove we made had to be tall : perhaps 1.10 -
>> 1.20 meter high. It was one of the tallest we ever made. The women said
>> they
>> would burn their arms on the hot skirt, and on the top of the pot, when
>> they
>> will reach food in the bottom of the pot.
>> They asked us to reduce the size, we said we couldn't since it was due to
>> the technology, and that a shorter stove would be less clean and
>> efficient.
>> We'll see in one week how they liked the stoves.
>>
>> Traditional stoves are convenient to use, but as you said they make "not
>> enough flame space to complete the combustion well."
>> All the institutional stoves I know (rocket, Lion stove, Esperanza stove,
>> LEGO stove) and some other wood stove (Justa stove, Lorena stove) seem all
>> to be working on the same principle: a combustion chamber tall enough for
>> the fire to burn properly, then the shape can vary. If the pot is big, so
>> must be the stove.
>>
>> Do you know any stove or any way to build a stove which would be small,
>> even
>> if it needs to deliver high power to cook on big pots? Have you faced user
>> acceptance issues because of the stove size ?
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Xavier
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Message d'origine-----
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 4
>> Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2011 09:46:14 -0400
>> From: "Crispin Pemberton-Pigott" <crispinpigott at gmail.com>
>> To: "Stoves" <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
>> Subject: [Stoves] Chimney Chula
>> Message-ID: <101001cc5376$0d935ef0$28ba1cd0$@gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>
>> Dear Friends
>>
>> http://www.designtoimprovelife.dk/index.php?option=com_content
>>
> <http://www.designtoimprovelife.dk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article
>> &id=81&Itemid=63> &view=article&id=81&Itemid=63
>>
>> It gets some recognition. Looks like a combination of an Esperanza stove
>> (small Lion with side-fed air) and a Lorena with pre-cast parts. Metal
>> grate
>> used. I like that! It gives all air preheating.
>>
>> An advantage (for India) is the very low cooking height though there is
>> obviously not enough flame space to complete the combustion well.
>>
>> Good looking.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Crispin
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Stoves mailing list
>>
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> .org
>>
>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves,  News and Information see our web site:
>> http://www.bioenergylists.org/
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
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>
> End of Stoves Digest, Vol 12, Issue 13
> **************************************
>
>
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>



-- 
***
Dr. A.D. Karve
President, Appropriate Rural Technology Institute (ARTI)

*Please change my email address in your records to: adkarve at gmail.com *



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