[Stoves] To Nat and others Re: Re Large TLUD --- TLUD Stove history

[Paul S. Anderson]

Dear Nat and all Stovers,

Your opinions are always welcome.  Even when inaccurate and out of context.

Best wishes with your work, about which we hope you will tell us soon.

Dr TLUD
(In the opinion of many, but clearly not all, I have earned this title.)
-- 
Paul S. Anderson, PhD
Known to some as:  Dr. TLUD    Doc    Professor
Phone (USA): 309-452-7072   SKYPE: paultlud   Email: psanders at ilstu.edu
www.gtz.de/de/dokumente/giz2011-en-micro-gasification.pdf   (Best ref.)


Quoting Nat of WorldStove <nataniele at aim.com>:

>
>
>
> Paul,I was shocked by the self promoting and derogatory statement  
> you madethe other day. Itwas neither correct nor in keeping with the  
> purpose and focus of thislist.
>
>
> Itis largely thanks to Ron and other greats like Tom Miles,  
> AlexEnglish and Andrew Heggie that this list exists.
>
>
> Ron,it should be noted, was thefirst stoves list coordinator and  
> help set the tone and tradition ofshared knowledge which lead to so  
> many advances in this community andfield.  He is the first who  
> brought the concept of charcoal producingstoves to this list and was  
> already making gasifying-biocharproducing stoves Sweden, Zimbabwe,  
> and Ethiopia years before most onthis list (including you) were even  
> aware of the need for improvedcook stoves.
>
>
> Asfor the Tom Reed Ron Larson duo, to state, as you did, that  
> "Whateverthe name, Reed and Larson missed it and Wendelbo and  
> Anderson gotit right." would be like saying Otto Lilienthal and the  
> Wrightbothers missed the whole flying thing.
>
>
> The fluid dynamic principlesestablished by Reed and Larson permitted  
> the existence of themodern-day gasifying stove studies and the  
> technical strengths andgenerous sharing of knowledge by Reed and  
> Larson allowed people withno formal technical background or training  
> such as yourself to enterthis field.
>
>
> Thata geography professor can now give himself the “title” of  
> “DrTLUD”(apparently implying a degree in something related to  
> stoves)is thanks to the work that was done before by people  
> likeReed, Larson, Wendelbo, Pemberton-Pigott and others who  
> patientlytaught you and helped you improve your stove design and who  
> appliedthermodynamics and fluid dynamics to the study of improved  
> cookstoves.
>
>
> AsI noted yesterday, there are many stoves that have come  
> beforeincluding the TLUD by Giese published in 1959 which had  
> primary andsecondary air control, double walls and concentrator  
> ring. I know ofothers that even predate Giese; so to say that  
> “Anderson got itright” [… ]“in 2005” would be like trying to claim  
> credit forthe invention of the lightbulb in 2011.
>
>
>
> Allof us on this list (especially those who work on micro gasifiers)  
> andthroughout the stoveing community owe an infinite debt of thanks  
> toLarson and Reed and all the others who came before us. I am  
> pleasedfor the progress your work seems to be be making but you (nor  
> any ofus) must forget the huge debt we ALL owe to those who were  
> doing thiswork well before us.
>
>
> Respectfully,
>
>
> Natof WorldStove
>
>
>
> Message:6
> Date:Mon, 29 Aug 2011 11:10:19 -0500
> From:"Paul S. Anderson" <psanders at ilstu.edu>
> To:Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
>    <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>, ajheggie at gmail.com
> Subject:Re: [Stoves] Wendlelbo's :  Re Large TLUD --- TLUD Stove
>    history
> Message-ID:
>    <20110829111019.78401kv21mphl6n4 at redbirdmail.illinoisstate.edu>
> Content-Type:text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes";
>    format="flowed"
>
>
>
> Andrewand all,   see below:
>
>
>
> Quotingajheggie at gmail.com:
>
>
>
>> On Sunday 28 August 2011 14:49:48 Paul S. Anderson wrote:
>>> (It took me four years 2001 to 2005 to get to that point of having ?
>>> concentrator lids on the TLUDs.
>>
>> Even the Reed-Larson stove diagrams from 1995ish showed aconcentrator,
>> essentially to disrupt flow and increase turbulence but it used the
>> term "bluff body", this is to induce mixing in the eddiesdownstream. In
>> that case it lead to a circle of flame around the edge of the stove,
>> mimicking a flame from a pre mixed gas appliance.
>
>
>
> Thefamous Reed-Larson device __spread__ the gases into an narrow
> annulus,which some might call "concentration while separating". That
> annuluswas its only serious defect because it did not have sufficient
> gasestogether to sustain a vigorous flame.
>
>
>
> Wendelboin the 1990s and Anderson in 2005 brought together the gases
> intoa central hole, which seems a more appropriate use of
> "concentrationwhile bringing together."
>
>
>
> Whateverthe name, Reed and Larson missed it and Wendelbo and Anderson
> gotit right.
>
>
>
> Therest of your message (below) gives an excellent description of why
> bottom-litfires are more smokey and harder to control.  If we could
> nowget more people to read and understand that message (which is the
> samefrom the "early days" or from "present day writings"),we will
> eventuallyget the IDD / TLUD technology into the minds of the the
> Stoversand eventually to the people who use the stoves.
>
>
>
> Paul
> --
> PaulS. Anderson, PhD
> Knownto some as:  Dr. TLUD
>
>
>
>
>



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