[Stoves] ETHOS 2013: Where is the New Data on Stove

Mon Nov 26 12:48:05 CST 2012

Dear Tom and all,

I wanted to jump into this conversation to emphasize that providing access to data on stove performance in the field is high on the priority list for the Global Alliance for Clean Cookstoves.

The recently released Stove Performance Inventory<http://www.cleancookstoves.org/resources/reports-and-research/?alliance_reports_research=alliance-reports&other=standards> has already been mentioned, which was an effort to pull together existing publically available data for laboratory and field testing.  We will be having a webinar<http://www.cleancookstoves.org/media-and-events/events/alliance-webinar-stove-performance-inventory.html> on December 11 4 pm GMT, which will cover the development of the inventory, results, an overview of the existing format for the Inventory, and discussion of next steps (keeping the inventory up to date, improving the accessibility and query-ability of the interface, etc).

All projects selected through the external peer review process and funded by the Global Alliance (published online<http://www.cleancookstoves.org/funding-opportunities/awardees.html> when the grants are finalized) are required to make their data publically available.  The most relevant field studies came out of a recent Request for Applications<http://www.cleancookstoves.org/funding-opportunities/field-studies-to-evaluate.html>, and these projects are currently getting started now.  The information about these studies is getting posted online as we speak, since these grants were only recently finalized.  And as these projects and other recently funded projects progress, that work and the resulting data will be shared.

A comment was also made about committees related to standards and testing.  We are working extremely hard to make discussions and meetings inclusive and widely attended.  We will continue to use channels like this listserv to keep everyone updated about upcoming activities (online, teleconference, and in person), and we will continue to support travel to help people attend meetings in person.  I have been posting regular updates on standards and testing activities in the Communities section<http://community.cleancookstoves.org/discussions/viewcategory/22> of the Global Alliance website, and I am happy to talk to anyone interested in more detailed updates.

Best regards,

Ranyee

[Description: Description: emailsignature]

Ranyee Chiang, Ph.D.
Senior Technical Manager
rchiang at cleancookstoves.org<mailto:rchiang at cleancookstoves.org>
www.cleancookstoves.org<http://www.cleancookstoves.org/>

Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2012 16:06:01 +0000

From: "Bryden, Kenneth [M E]" <kmbryden at iastate.edu<mailto:kmbryden at iastate.edu>>

To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves

        <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org<mailto:stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>>

Subject: Re: [Stoves] ETHOS 2013: Where is the New Data on Stove

        Performance in  the Field?

Message-ID:

        <75123EB3655A6E44B6FC942F119B90CA0373EF0E at ITSDAG4A.its.iastate.edu<mailto:75123EB3655A6E44B6FC942F119B90CA0373EF0E at ITSDAG4A.its.iastate.edu>>

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Tom,

Sounds like a great idea and I'm sure by the flurry of writing this weekend that it would attract a lot of interest. I also know that there are a lot of questions that need be answered.

Maybe a format that could work would be a panel for the whole group followed by a set of talks for those who wish to continue the discussion. Can you put together a panel and a set of talks that would represent the divergent views on this topic?

Dean - any thoughts

Thanks

Mark

On Nov 23, 2012, at 10:36 AM, Tom Miles wrote:

Mark,

You have listed a number of standards and protocol topics. Now that GACC exists have we made any gains on the science side? Where is the data?  We should be generating good field data by now. I don?t want to just hear reports about what people have decided in political committees that nobody seems to be able to attend or vote in.

I would like to see a critical review of the testing protocols and methods with regard to the key metrics and emissions. For example, the protocols to date have made assumptions about heating values of fuels and residues ash and charcoal that I have always felt were just placeholders until someone with larger research budgets could validate them. Determining the amount of energy left in the ash or charcoal is a good example. I often get asked what value to use for the remaining ash/charcoal. I haven?t seen a test where the remaining charcoal/ash has been directly tested for ash content and heating value.

Testing the benchmarks. Do the benchmarks that were derived several years ago make sense now that we have improved tools for measuring stove performance or do we get the same numbers because we?re using the same tools? Do the benchmarks tell us anything about stove performance in the field? Do stoves preform in the field in the same relative way they are shown to perform in the lab or are some stoves much better than others (or much worse) when they are used in the field? Are the stoves designed to the test (e.g. WBT) or to the use in the field? Do some stoves perform best when they are tested in the lab and fail in the field? Or, are we even testing for this?

Field applications. Are our tools and metrics of any use for improving stove performance in actual use? If so then how are projects in developing countries using these tools to improve their fuel use and health? How do local, nation, or regional stove projects use these tools to improve their stoves, or do they just ignore them?

QA/QC. When a program buys container loads of stoves how do we know that they perform within the expectations created by the test results? Do any of the manufactured stove suppliers test the quality and performance of their stoves on a regular basis? Is there any monitoring?

How has testing been used for different fuels? I was inspired this week by a photo from Mexican which a construction worker was using an LPG burner in an eCocina stove (Stove Team International) because it substantially reduced his LG use. Can we compare fuel consumption for different fuels? How good are our fuel consumption metrics?

Health. We still do not have proven direct correlation between stove emissions and heath. Most of the data seems to be recycled. Are there new health studies? Has GACC and the many supporting organizations funded any of the fundamental health studies that every year Jay Smith tells us are lacking?

These are some of the questions that I would like to see addressed at ETHOS.

Looking forward to another productive ETHOS.

Thanks

Tom

T R Miles Technical Consultants, Inc.

tmiles at trmiles.com<mailto:tmiles at trmiles.com<mailto:tmiles at trmiles.com%3cmailto:tmiles at trmiles.com>>

www.trmiles.com<http://www.trmiles.com<http://www.trmiles.com%3chttp:/www.trmiles.com>>

www.stove.bioenergylists.org<http://www.stove.bioenergylists.org<http://www.stove.bioenergylists.org%3chttp:/www.stove.bioenergylists.org>>

From: ethos-bounces at vrac.iastate.edu<mailto:ethos-bounces at vrac.iastate.edu<mailto:ethos-bounces at vrac.iastate.edu%3cmailto:ethos-bounces at vrac.iastate.edu>> [mailto:ethos-bounces at vrac.iastate.edu]<mailto:[mailto:ethos-bounces at vrac.iastate.edu]> On Behalf Of Bryden, Kenneth [M E]

Sent: Monday, October 22, 2012 2:05 PM

To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves; ETHOS - Listserve

Subject: [Ethos] ETHOS 2013

All,

It's that time of year again! We're starting to get the activities together together for the ETHOS conference. The conference will be January 25 - 27, 2013 in Seattle. Proposed discussion topics include

- Update on the Global Alliance and their activities

- Standardizing Reporting on IWA Indicators

- Stove Performance Inventory, Sharing Public Data, and Establishing Common Data Formats

- Update on ISO Process

- Updates on Protocol Developments (including possibly charcoal, plancha, batch-fed, durability, finalizing WBT from public comment period)

Let us know what else you would like to talk about. A lot is happening and I'm sure it will be as exciting as ever. I'd appreciate having your ideas on topics and panels by November 15.

Abstracts for papers and talks are due January 1.

For more details, to register, and to submit your abstract the conference web site is http://www.vrac.iastate.edu/ethos/conference.php.

Please send your ideas directly to Dean and I.

Best regards

Mark

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Message: 6

Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2012 08:19:46 -0800

From: "Tom Miles" <tmiles at trmiles.com<mailto:tmiles at trmiles.com>>

To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'"

        <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org<mailto:stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>>

Subject: Re: [Stoves] ETHOS 2013: Where is the New Data on Stove

        Performance     in      the Field?

Message-ID: <00db01cdcbf1$da33d800$8e9b8800$@trmiles.com<mailto:00db01cdcbf1$da33d800$8e9b8800$@trmiles.com>>

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Good idea. We can work on it over the next few of weeks. Sorting out the objectives and use of tests, methods and formal protocols would be the place to start.

Tom

From: Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org]<mailto:[mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org]> On Behalf Of Bryden, Kenneth [M E]

Sent: Monday, November 26, 2012 8:06 AM

To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves

Subject: Re: [Stoves] ETHOS 2013: Where is the New Data on Stove Performance in the Field?

Tom,

Sounds like a great idea and I'm sure by the flurry of writing this weekend that it would attract a lot of interest. I also know that there are a lot of questions that need be answered.

Maybe a format that could work would be a panel for the whole group followed by a set of talks for those who wish to continue the discussion. Can you put together a panel and a set of talks that would represent the divergent views on this topic?

Dean - any thoughts

Thanks

Mark

On Nov 23, 2012, at 10:36 AM, Tom Miles wrote:

Mark,

You have listed a number of standards and protocol topics. Now that GACC exists have we made any gains on the science side? Where is the data?  We should be generating good field data by now. I don't want to just hear reports about what people have decided in political committees that nobody seems to be able to attend or vote in.

I would like to see a critical review of the testing protocols and methods with regard to the key metrics and emissions. For example, the protocols to date have made assumptions about heating values of fuels and residues ash and charcoal that I have always felt were just placeholders until someone with larger research budgets could validate them. Determining the amount of energy left in the ash or charcoal is a good example. I often get asked what value to use for the remaining ash/charcoal. I haven't seen a test where the remaining charcoal/ash has been directly tested for ash content and heating value.

Testing the benchmarks. Do the benchmarks that were derived several years ago make sense now that we have improved tools for measuring stove performance or do we get the same numbers because we're using the same tools? Do the benchmarks tell us anything about stove performance in the field? Do stoves preform in the field in the same relative way they are shown to perform in the lab or are some stoves much better than others (or much worse) when they are used in the field? Are the stoves designed to the test (e.g. WBT) or to the use in the field? Do some stoves perform best when they are tested in the lab and fail in the field? Or, are we even testing for this?

Field applications. Are our tools and metrics of any use for improving stove performance in actual use? If so then how are projects in developing countries using these tools to improve their fuel use and health? How do local, nation, or regional stove projects use these tools to improve their stoves, or do they just ignore them?

QA/QC. When a program buys container loads of stoves how do we know that they perform within the expectations created by the test results? Do any of the manufactured stove suppliers test the quality and performance of their stoves on a regular basis? Is there any monitoring?

How has testing been used for different fuels? I was inspired this week by a photo from Mexican which a construction worker was using an LPG burner in an eCocina stove (Stove Team International) because it substantially reduced his LG use. Can we compare fuel consumption for different fuels? How good are our fuel consumption metrics?

Health. We still do not have proven direct correlation between stove emissions and heath. Most of the data seems to be recycled. Are there new health studies? Has GACC and the many supporting organizations funded any of the fundamental health studies that every year Jay Smith tells us are lacking?

These are some of the questions that I would like to see addressed at ETHOS.

Looking forward to another productive ETHOS.

Thanks

Tom

T R Miles Technical Consultants, Inc.

tmiles at trmiles.com<mailto:tmiles at trmiles.com>

www.trmiles.com<http://www.trmiles.com>

www.stove.bioenergylists.org<http://www.stove.bioenergylists.org>

From: ethos-bounces at vrac.iastate.edu<mailto:ethos-bounces at vrac.iastate.edu> [mailto:ethos-bounces at vrac.iastate.edu]<mailto:[mailto:ethos-bounces at vrac.iastate.edu]>

On Behalf Of Bryden, Kenneth [M E]

Sent: Monday, October 22, 2012 2:05 PM

To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves; ETHOS - Listserve

Subject: [Ethos] ETHOS 2013

All,

It's that time of year again! We're starting to get the activities together together for the ETHOS conference. The conference will be January 25 - 27,

2013 in Seattle. Proposed discussion topics include

- Update on the Global Alliance and their activities

- Standardizing Reporting on IWA Indicators

- Stove Performance Inventory, Sharing Public Data, and Establishing Common Data Formats

- Update on ISO Process

- Updates on Protocol Developments (including possibly charcoal, plancha, batch-fed, durability, finalizing WBT from public comment period)

Let us know what else you would like to talk about. A lot is happening and I'm sure it will be as exciting as ever. I'd appreciate having your ideas on topics and panels by November 15.

Abstracts for papers and talks are due January 1.

For more details, to register, and to submit your abstract the conference web site is http://www.vrac.iastate.edu/ethos/conference.php.

Please send your ideas directly to Dean and I.

Best regards

Mark

_______________________________________________

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to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists

.org

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http://www.bioenergylists.org/

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