[Stoves] FW: pot skirt efficiency estimates, scale-up

[Joshua Guinto]

Dear Crispin and Kevin

First of all, let me thank you for your prompt and very intelligent
comments. It makes me feel more secured now that i learned somethings new
and very important.

I will do as Crispin says, lower the height of the secondary air entrance,
do a fuel grate, break up the entry of the primary air to get a good
central alignment of the flame and then the back brick.

Tommorow morning is another big day. These comments came just in time
before i install the jar on top of the combustion chamber.

By the way, another big name in the stove design community is here with me
in the project but on another mission. Engr Alexis Belonio will have a lot
to suggest when he sees the set up tommorow. I look forward to it.

To respond to some of Kevins question.

they are in between the lines...

2012/9/19 Kevin C <kchisholm at ca.inter.net>

>
> Dear Jed
>
> Crispin has made sopme very good suggestions for improving on the "stove
> aspects" of your still. There is nothing I can add to what Crispin suggests.
>
> I might be able to help with operation of the distilling aspects of your
> project.
>
> 1: Is it a continuous process or a batch process?
>

It is a batch process, one load is about 115 liters .


> 2: What is the volume of "feed wine" that your boiler will hold?
>


> 3: What percentage of ethanol do you want in your final distillate product?
>

Hmmm right now, the latest test indicates 70 percent with the traditional
methods We want to increase that to as much as 90 %.

4: Do you use a simple condenser, where you simply condense all the vapor
> that is boiled off, or do you use a reflux column?
>

We use a simple condenser. Actually, i have a clay condenser fabricated.
But i neglected to have the inside walls glazed. So i will only use that
until it is glazed. For the meantime we will use the metal condensers that
the locals fabricate themselves.


> 5: What is the initial alcohol content of the "feed wine?"
>

That i wll check tommorow

6: How many litres per hour of "feed wine" do you wish to process?
>

Sixteen liters in one hour will already be satisfying.


>
> I don't understand your separating technology. What is condensed or cooled
> in the "Radiator?"
>

The radiator was meant to cool off he cooling water that runs on top of the
condenser so we may use them again in a continuing cycle.



> What is the source and  nature of the "waste water" that is being sent to
> the "Waste Water Treatment tanks?"
>

This would be the distillate, the spent liquid after the distillation. I
would not want them disposed directly to the creeks.


>
> You would probably benefit from Thermometers at various points in the
> still and condensers. You should also have valves in the water cooling
> pipes, to regulate the flow rate of water from your head tank.
>

Yes, i agree. I think i will do a monitoring chart for every point ...


>
> Am I correct in assuming that your "Radiator Assembly" cools your
> condenser or reflux column water flow, to permit re-use? If so, you could
> use a radiator or two (depending on how much heat you have to dissipate)
> from scrapped automobiles for cooling the condenser water for re-use.
>

Good idea. For now im using a simple fine net like those of the mosquito
nets. I do not know if it will not melt off


>
> Your pottery boiler looks great! I presume you are using it, to minimize
> differences in operation from the technology presently being employed.
>
>
The present technology is actually the use of metal drums they get from the
industries..... They could contains remains of chemicals, diesel, oil,
shampoo or anything. they clean the drums very crudely. The drums lasts
only for several months because of metal fatique. Then they wlll have to be
replaced.

The clay boiler is actually going back from the modern to the more native.



> Best wishes,
>
> Kevin Chisholm
>
>
> Thank you both once again. More news  to come
>

Jed

> Quoting jed.building.bridges at gmail.com**:
>
>  Dear All
>>
>> With all respects, i wish to join in the discussion with my own concern
>> similar to that of Josh Kearns.
>>
>> Im at present building an improved wine distillery in favor of the small
>> nipa wine producers in my hometown. The constructin is now in full scale
>> and
>> so im beginning to really get worried about the integrity of my design.
>>
>> I do not have enough engineering background on this and do not have much
>> equipments. So i would really appreciate it if you could also guide me
>> through with this project.
>>
>> I attached some photos and drawings of the project.
>>
>> It was organized by a Japanese  JICA volunteer and will help more than 200
>> wine producers not to mention their health and the immediate environment.
>>
>> Best regards
>>
>> JEd Guinto
>>
>> 2012/9/16 Paul Anderson <psanders at ilstu.edu>
>>
>> Josh,
>>
>> From experience, having the heat go through a single pipe/chimney in the
>> center of the water tank is much better than having  the heat go around
>> the
>> outside of the steel drum.    And it is much less expansive.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Paul S. Anderson, PhD  aka "Dr TLUD"
>> Email:  psanders at ilstu.edu   Skype: paultlud  Phone: +1-309-452-7072
>> Website:  www.drtlud.com
>>
>> On 9/14/2012 11:36 PM, Josh Kearns wrote:
>>
>> I'm thinking about building a 5-gal TLUD fired 55-gal water heater for
>> outdoor showers. I'm wondering if anyone has a ballpark estimate for heat
>> transfer efficiency w/ and w/o using a pot skirt attachment. The hot water
>> tank will be a 55-gal steel drum, so I think the setup is pretty analogous
>> to a cookstove setup, just bigger.
>>
>>
>>
>> 20%?
>>
>>
>>
>> Any thoughts are helpful, rough estimates OK.....thanks!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> FYI, the char from the water heating setup will be used in arbor-loo style
>> modular composting toilets. This infrastructure is being installed during
>> a
>> rambo design-and-build sesh for my wedding on a farm in rural Appalachia
>> (USA), but will be used continually by future events at the site. Cool,
>> huh?!?!
>>
>>
>>
>> Josh
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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