[Stoves] plant physiology-tsw reply

Tadeusz S. Wysocki Jr. ursted48 at hotmail.com
Mon Dec 2 09:27:24 CST 2013


Hello Francis,
Hope you had a good Thanksgiving.
Please see the following discussion.
You have the knowledge and skills to run internal combustion engines( generators, cars, trucks, buses, etc. ) on wood gases. Your childhood in post war Japan had to resort to wood power to fuel their buses.
Rural areas in China still uses this technology, and this could be adapted to Haiti.
The" Gambian corn" seeds that you sent me produced edible corn cobs, and a lot of biomass.
What impressed me was its drought resistance, and deep root system, and the several layer of "buttress" roots that would stabilize even dessert sand.
I have able to convert wood chips into humus in less than a year using soil fungus.
This in combination with horticultural charcoal allowed me to grow potatoes and tomatoes in blighted soil.
 
It may be possible to have a combination of plants tailored for Haiti, that could produce biochar, fuel pellets, food while controlling erosion.
Best regards,
Ted.
 
Date: Sun, 1 Dec 2013 16:50:00 -0500
From: lhelferty at sympatico.ca
To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
Subject: Re: [Stoves] plant physiology


  
    
  
  
    Michael,

      

        Wow!  That is just amazing!  I am just so very glad that you
      have been able to take so much wisdom from the "collective body"
      of knowledge about 'sustainable cropping' for bioenergy, biochar
      and soil sustainability.  (It is also wonderful to read about your
      focus on soils -- and Vetiver grass [Chrysopogon
      zizanioides].)

        I, for one, am completely onside with what you are attempting to
      do in Haiti -- and would be very willing to assist you in whatever
      way I can to help make what you have described a reality ~ for I
      believe that this agro-ecological 'systems approach'
      [permaculture] would not only be relevant to Haiti, but could and
      should also be very relevant to so many other places around
      the world. (Wherever Vetiver grows.)

       [Note: I have also recently plugged into the global 'Vetiver
      Network', and am learning more about the amazing potential for
      these grasses to become sustainable bioenergy feedstocks.]

      

       If there is any way that I might be able to assist in helping
      with the development of some of this "portable machinery" (the
      pyrolitic downdraft gasifiers that can run portable generators)
      for producing electricity and other useful products ~ including
      the harvesting and pellet machines themselves...  these are the
      type of small, integrated systems that I would very much wish to
      support [in terms of testing, training and deployment] ~ not only
      in Haiti, but anywhere else around the world where these systems
      may be applicable.  [i.e. the rest of the Caribbean and probably
      many other Small Island Developing States in the Pacific ~
      South-East Asia and, in fact, probably in many/most other
      countries of the so-called "Global South".]

      

      Regards,

        Lloyd Helferty, Engineering Technologist
  Principal, Biochar Consulting (Canada)
  www.biochar-consulting.ca
  48 Suncrest Blvd, Thornhill, ON, Canada
  905-707-8754
  CELL: 647-886-8754
     Skype: lloyd.helferty
  Steering Committee coordinator
  Canadian Biochar Initiative (CBI)
  President, Co-founder & CBI Liaison, Biochar-Ontario
  National Office, Canadian Carbon Farming Initiative (CCFI)
  Organizing team member, 2013 N/A Biochar Symposium:
    www.carbon-negative.us/symposium
  Member of the Don Watershed Regeneration Council (DWRC)
  Manager, Biochar Offsets Group:
           http://www.linkedin.com/groups?home=&gid=2446475
   Advisory Committee Member, IBI
  http://www.linkedin.com/groups?gid=1404717
  http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=42237506675
  http://groups.google.com/group/biochar-ontario
  http://www.meetup.com/biocharontario/
  http://www.biocharontario.ca
   www.biochar.ca

"Producing twice as much food with diminishing resources, without further loss of natural habitats and biodiversity and in a changing climate may be the greatest challenge facing humanity."
   - Lloyd Helferty
      On 2013-12-01 12:01 PM, Michael Mahowald wrote:

    
    
      
      
        Dear All,
        

        
        Very good and needed discussion,
        

        
        This is the most important thing we are currently looking
          for at Haiti Reconstruction Intl.
        

        
        We have discussed and planed using fast growing nitrogen
          fixing trees in hedgerows on mountainsides for trimming and
          getting fuel wood for cooking stoves.  But we now believe
          their need is greater and with the millions that need it we
          have to use pellets nationwide.
        We know the greatest problem in Haiti and most of the world
          is erosion and lack of good top soil especially on hilly
          terrain. We also know vetiver grass is the best plant to not
          only stop erosion but it can replenish the soil with the
          terraces it makes when planted correctly.
        Vetiver has the highest photosynthetic activity of any
          plant according to Dr. Massimo Maffei of the University of
          Turin Italy.  Other plants may produce more tons per acre
          total weight but contain 50% more moisture.  Vetiver hay when
          dried can produce 70 to 80 tons per hectare of cellulosic
          biomass. 
        
          This grass with 3 meter roots can be trimmed twice a year without hurting its terrace
              building ability.  Leaves when dried are turned into fuel
              pellets without any detriment to the plants to stop
              erosion.  Once the terraces are established moisture is
              retained and gardens can be planted behind the vetiver.
               Haiti's mountainous terrain needs so much vetiver they
              can produce millions of pounds of pellets a year.  
          The miraculous TLUD will turn grass into gas that burns clean,
              (save lives of those who cook with it) and leaves the
              carbon to put back into the soil behind the hedgerows to enhance the soil.  This will also clean the atmosphere
              and reverse effects on global warming!
          Our goal is to make pellets cheap enough not only for
            TLUD cook stoves.  We feel in order to do this we must
            perfect pyrolitic downdraft gasifiers with low tar levels that can run portable generators.  We need portable
              electricity and machinery where the grass is cut to shred,
              grind, form into pellets and seal them in plastic bags.   These clean bags of pellets
              can be sold in markets by the same street venders who
              currently sell dirty charcoal.  Those who cut trees to
              make charcoal, can now make a living. planting, cutting
              and making vetiver pellets.  
          This perfect circle of permaculture design and its
            byproduct of hedgerows that create their own terraces.
             These terraces will create humus as they collect leaves and
            debris.  Humus and biochar will hold moisture and
            microorganisms.  Vetiver can also be used for composting,
            and toilets will stop the spread of cholera, hedgerows
            stopping erosion keep anthrax spores buried deep preventing
            epidemics!   Fruit trees will once again grow on
            mountainsides.  Gardens can be planted and food will grow so
            bountifully they will be exporting it.  Eventually there
            will be enough vetiver to run generators for small towns to
            process food for export.
        
        

        
        No one man our group can accomplish everything, but I know
          this is all possible with more help.
        

        
        I am hoping any of you may want to help us, we need to find
          universities and groups from every organization to chip in.
        

        
        

        
        Please join us at HRI website(click on this Haiti Reconstruction International )
        Michael E. Mahowald
          President

            Haiti
                  Reconstruction International
            952-220-6814
          
          
            From: cookswelljikos

            To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org

            Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2013 17:11:37 -0800

            Subject: Re: [Stoves] plant physiology

            

            
            
            
              
                Dear Bob,  

                
                
                  From personal experience most
                    rural Kenyan's I have met are little concerned with
                    outsiders expectations of how they should manage
                    their natural resources and landscapes. As it is
                    today, a large part woodfuel in Kenya (both
                    commercial and domestic) is coming from farm forests
                    or Trust land since the Govt. bans on harvesting
                    plantations in the 1990's. (please see http://www.inforse.org/Case/Case-Kenya-Afforestation.php3 and  http://www.acts.or.ke/dmdocuments/Acacia%20Pocketbook%20low%20res.pdf and
                    also http://worldagroforestry.org/newsroom/media_coverage/agroforestry-can-meet-charcoal-demand-kenya and
                    also http://rael.berkeley.edu/bailis_phd
                     for some recent studies).  

                  
                
                
                  Tree's can be planted during
                    the rainy season to minimize need for watering and
                    can be grown as alley-crops or fence line windbreaks
                    etc. and thus not overly compete for arable land.   
                    

                  
                
                
                  My interest in this is from my
                    understanding that by designing, manufacturing and
                    selling cookstoves, ovens and kilns that make it
                    easier and cheaper for people to burn trees, I have
                    very strong vested interests and a responsibility to
                    advocate and encourage positive woodfuel security
                    measures. I know not everyone of my customers will
                    be able to take part in the ''seed-to-ash'' cycle
                    (please see below), but I am always thrilled when
                    the early adapters do. And if we can help subsidize
                    the cost of fuel for our customers, they hopefully
                    can use the money saved to buy another model of
                    stove from us. 

                    

                    Back to my question of the possible discussion of
                    fuels at the ETHOS conference, is this something
                    that is of interest to any of you?  

                  
                
                
                  The more I read about ETHOS
                    the more I want to come to learn more! I have been
                    sending quite a few stoves to the USA from Nbi. and
                    I would love to meet some customers and do some
                    M&E on how our North American clients use our
                    jikos.  

                  
                
                
                  Thanks and any thoughts,
                    critics and comments any of you have is always very
                    instructive to me.  

                  
                
                
                  Teddy  

                  
                
                
                  
                    
                      
                        Cookswell Jikos

                          www.cookswell.co.ke
                      
                      
                        www.facebook.com/CookswellJikos
                      
                      
                        www.kenyacharcoal.blogspot.com
                      
                      
                        Mobile: +254 700 380
                          009 
                      
                      
                        Mobile: +254 700 905 913
                      
                      
                        P.O. Box 1433, Nairobi
                          00606, Kenya
                      
                    
                  
                  -----

                  
                  
                    On Sat, Nov 30, 2013 at 6:52
                      AM, <rbtvl>
                      wrote:
                    
                      thanks
                          Arnand 

                        
                    
                    
                      I
                          hope to come to Ethos but might be in Tanzania
                          working. 

                        
                    
                    
                      do
                          you have any data on how much fuel you can
                          grow at some maximum rate?     

                        
                    
                    
                      My
                          concern is that we can't expect poor rural
                          people to focus their water gathering energies
                          and land use on firewood production.  Of
                          course, if they can burn dried up corn plants
                          and stuff like that it is all to the good. 
                          integrating growth of fuel and food is always
                          a good idea. 

                        
                    
                    
                      bob
                          

                        
                    
                    
                       
                    
                    
                      -----Original
                          Message-----

                          From: Anand Karve

                          To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>

                          Sent: Fri, Nov 29, 2013 10:40 pm

                          Subject: Re: [Stoves] ETHOS program growing
                          firewood
                      
                        
                          Dear
                              Bob Lange and Stovers,
                        
                        
                          I
                              am a plant physiologist. I won't mind
                              attending Ethos Meeting if somebody pays
                              me my air fare and local expenses.
                        
                        
                          The
                              high energy in seeds and tubers that you
                              mention has nothing to do with the
                              physical calorific value of these
                              substances. They have a high content of
                              digestible matter so that the energy
                              becomes available to you, when you eat
                              them. Burning sugar, starch, cellulose or
                              lignin would release about the same
                              quantity of energy per unit weight.
                              Because cellulose and lignin are not
                              digestible to humans, the straw and stover
                              from crop plants, constituting about 60 to
                              70% of the total biomass, is available to
                              the farmer to be used as fuel. It must
                              however be processed to increase its
                              energy density to resemble that of wood.
                        
                        
                          Yours
                        
                        
                          A.D.Karve

                               
                        
                        
                          On
                              Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 5:09 PM, <rbtvl> wrote:
                          
                            I
                                think we should invite a plant
                                physiologist to come to ETHOS to explain
                                why  we should not focus on getting
                                people to grow their own fuel.   Plants
                                are living things. In the first place
                                they are not very efficient at all in
                                catching the energy in sun light.  But
                                what they do catch they put mostly into
                                metabolism and reproduction.   Like us
                                animals.  That is why we eat seeds.  
                                They are loaded with energy that the
                                plant put there for their young to use
                                until the little ones can
                                photosynthesize for themselves.   
                                Mammals use the mother's milk   Plants
                                use their seeds.  (Some animals, not
                                mammals, use eggs for reproduction.  So
                                we eat eggs.) 

                              
                          
                          
                            If you
                                are rural and poor and have a little
                                land and sufficient water, you will
                                almost certainly want to grow food
                                itself rather than fire wood.  
                                no?  Fire wood is very demanding of land
                                area.   You can be clever and minimize
                                it. This species that species.    but it
                                is land expensive.   Because the part of
                                the plant you burn for fuel is not
                                important to the plant, except to
                                support its leaves.  so the  plant puts
                                minimal energy there. 

                              
                          
                          
                            If
                                growing fuel wood is going to be taken
                                seriously, it should be a government
                                task.  Local or national  government.  
                                Centralize it.   Do it big and well on
                                land that individual families don't need
                                to grow food itself.  do it on land that
                                is difficult to use for other things. 
                                On the sides of hills.  someplace
                                useless.  someplace rocky.  Make it a
                                campaign in the Global Alliance's
                                "enabling environment". 

                              
                          
                          
                            Funny,
                                but the problem is that people cook so
                                much.   What we need are more species of
                                plants and animals that produce parts
                                that we could find nourishing and tasty
                                and desirable without cooking at all.  
                                Damn it.   Why do we have to heat up
                                food so much?   Maybe soak the food in
                                some liquid like fruit juice or spices
                                some natural acid for all day and then
                                serve it.   I know cooking has a very
                                significant role in make food culturally
                                and physiologically acceptable.   But If
                                only we could find more foods that were
                                good for us, culturally and
                                physiologically, but eaten raw.  That
                                would be real stove progress.  I
                                personally like to eat almost all
                                vegetables raw.   even beans and corn. 
                                I don't know if I am throwing away a lot
                                of their nutrition, though. 

                              
                          
                          
                            Bob
                                Lange    Maasai stoves and solar.

                            
                          
                        
                      
                    
                  
                
              
            
          
        
      
    
    <snip>
 		 	   		  
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