[Stoves] The price of bottled gas

Sun May 5 13:04:34 CDT 2013

Hi Otto,

I definately consider biomass to be sutable for low income households...I
probably wouldn't be part of this list if I didn't. I think that the work
people are doing on this listserv is vital and important. I spent two years
working on using biomass for households. I believe that families need to be
presented with various stove options. Just because I support the use of LPG
doesn't mean I am against biomass. I am the most concerned with health
impact. I just don't believe that on this listserv we should be promoting
not using LPG.  We are here to try and save lives and improve health. I
think that Kirk Smiths opening comments at the Clean Cooking Forum are very
clear about what steps need to be INCLUDED to reach our ultimate health
goals. So I believe that we need to as Kirk Smith said, transition a
portion of the people that are using purchased wood to gas/electricity. The
most dificult task remains developing clean stoves that are affordable for
families that don't have enough income to purchase fuel.

My work is focused on designing affordable ways to distribute and adopt
stoves, while focusing on a way to increrase houeshold education of HAP. We
conducted a survey in Guatemala of 300 households to learn more about fuel
use, fuel preference, stacking, fuel perception, willingness to pay, level
of education about HAP, etc.

Hope that helps to clear up any confusion.

Best,

Christina

On Sunday, May 5, 2013, Otto Formo wrote:

>  Cristina,
> I just noticed your comment on the statement to Paul O:
> "Are we not concerned about global warming each time that we switch on a
> modern gas stove?"
> " *Are you saying that poor people shouldn't be allowed to use fossil
> fuels?"*
> Do you realy consider biomass not suitable for the low income households??
>
> I am using firewood from the nearby forest and considering instaling a
> pellet boiler, approximate 30 YEARS after the first Swede started to use
> his pellet and wood chip burner.
> Well, some people say Sweden has been better off, since VOLVO has moved to
> China, but still..............:)
>
> Norway is exporting 99% of LPG produced to US and Europe.
>
> Thanks
>
> Otto
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> Date: Sun, 5 May 2013 01:41:33 -0700
> From: c_espinosa1 at u.pacific.edu <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml',
> 'c_espinosa1 at u.pacific.edu');>
> To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml',
> 'stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org');>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] The price of bottled gas
>
> Hi Paul,
>
> Yes Guatemala does have a fair amount of agricultural residues. We worked
> on designing briquetting models and had a hard time with some of the
> available types of biomass. I am sure Richard could comment on this more
> since he started working here with some groups on designing a mix with the
> kinds of biomass that we have available.
>
> Also the infrastructure requirements for LPG and natural gas are different.
>
> Here is the FAO breakdown for Guatemala:
> http://faostat.fao.org/DesktopDefault.aspx?PageID=339&lang=en&country=89
>
> The most abundant biomass available here is with sugarcane and banana
> growers. When we talked with a large company growing
> bananas they expressed that they were investigating ways to turn the
> flower plams (I think that is what they are called) into electricity.
> Again, the sugar cane growers I think are using the biomass for the same
> kinds of things. So Guatemala's two largest sources of
> biomass are or are in plans to be utilized for energy. Coffee husks might
> be one of the more available types. I remember reading
> something a year ago about coffee husks giving of a urine smell when
> gasified. Is this still true? Maybe someone can comment on
> this.
>
> Richard might be able to comment some more since he has worked here with
> biomass.
>
> You say " Are we not concerned about global warming each time that we
> switch on a modern gas stove?" Are you saying that poor people shouldn't
> be allowed to use fossil fuels?
>
> I thought we already talked about this. I think its not fair to expect
> poor people to adopt ONLY biomass because we are concerned about global
> warming. We need to stop treating poor people with the expectation that
> they should shoulder the burden of adopting ONLY renewable fuels. We need
> to let these families have an affordable option to use what they perfer
> whether it be gas, biomass, etc.
>
> I think the work you are doing in Vietnam is great, but I urge you to be
> conscious of the differences in countries. Guatemala is not
> Vietnam...Guatemala is not India...China is not Tanzania.
>
> Best,
>
> Christina
>
> On Sunday, May 5, 2013, Paul Olivier wrote:
>
> Christina,
>
> How available is natural gas in Guatemala? Is it not made available to the
> people by oil and gas companies? No doubt it takes an incredible
> infrastructure to make it available to them in bottled form.
>
> I would imagine that Guatemala generates fairly important quantities of
> agricultural residues. Perhaps what you are really saying is that the
> infrastructure needed to make predictable biomass fuel available to the
> people of Guatemala is not yet in place. It is precisely such an
> infrastructure we should be working on.
>
> Whenever and wherever possible, in rich or poor countries alike, we should
> look for every opportunity to replace bottled gas with syngas. Why burn
> non-renewable fossil fuels, especially when agricultural residues could be
> transformed into predictable fuels that are thoroughly renewable? Are we
> not concerned about global warming each time that we switch on a modern gas
> stove?
>
> Thanks.
> Paul Olivier
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, May 5, 2013 at 9:15 AM, Christina Espinosa <
> c_espinosa1 at u.pacific.edu> wrote:
>
> In Guatemala, the current price
>
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-- 
Christina Espinosa
University of the Pacific '10
School of International Studies
c_espinosa1 at u.pacific.edu
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