[Stoves] Is LPG all that bad?
Bernhard Müller
bs_mueller at gmx.net
Mon Dec 1 18:01:16 CST 2014
Dear Anand and all,
you delivered the best argument against LPG yourself: it is a side product of petroleum refining and therefore subject to scarcity, transportation, storage, packing, price increases. Also you mentioned another counter-argument: the cylinders can (must) be carried. It’s a dead end road.
It is in use widely in Europe and the US in remote places where LNG and electricity is not available, though. Also, throughout Africa one can easily obtain it in cities. At the current income situation I do not see a way to disseminate LPG cooking to rural areas in developing countries. Well, Crispin said it all.
Bernhard S. Müller
Mühlstr. 26
65760 Eschborn
Germany
> Am 01.12.2014 um 20:00 schrieb stoves-request at lists.bioenergylists.org:
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Is LPG all that bad? (Anand Karve)
> 2. Re: Is LPG all that bad? (Crispin Pemberton-Pigott)
> 3. Re: Is LPG all that bad? (nari phaltan)
> 4. Re: Is LPG all that bad? (Philip Lloyd)
> 5. Re: Is LPG all that bad? (Saloop T S)
> 6. Re: Very interesting Stove (Thailand?)
> (d.michael.shafer at gmail.com)
> 7. Re: wood stove with vitroceramic griddle
> (Rogerio carneiro de miranda)
> 8. Toxic wood (Crispin Pemberton-Pigott)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2014 07:02:20 +0530
> From: Anand Karve <adkarve at gmail.com>
> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: [Stoves] Is LPG all that bad?
> Message-ID:
> <CACPy7SeRB-3RJ0jiUnybuntW1fuu_BFUMU1s4YGH1KzmmAQDqg at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Dear List,
> I saw recently a lot of criticism against LPG. As cooking fuel, it is
> really superb, giving a blue flame without smoke or soot,
> instantaneous ignition, finger-tip control of flame intensity, no ash,
> etc. Being liquifiable, relatively large quantities of it can be
> filled into cylinders which occupy very little space in the kitchen.
> One can carry the cylinder around if the gas is needed elsewhere. I
> understand that LPG is a by product of petroleum refining and that one
> cannot avoid the production of LPG as long as we are using petroleum
> and refining it. So, if we stopped using it as cooking fuel, we shall
> have to find an alternative use for it.
> Yours
> A.D.Karve
> ***
> Dr. A.D. Karve
>
> Chairman, Samuchit Enviro Tech Pvt Ltd (www.samuchit.com)
>
> Trustee & Founder President, Appropriate Rural Technology Institute (ARTI)
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2014 20:49:04 -0500
> From: Crispin Pemberton-Pigott <crispinpigott at outlook.com>
> To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Is LPG all that bad?
> Message-ID: <COL401-EAS1753A25D8D0FEC1796F0D29B17D0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2014 10:04:29 +0530
> From: nari phaltan <nariphaltan at gmail.com>
> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Is LPG all that bad?
> Message-ID:
> <CAGeG2tDBzb3hro_sAuLbeVvDnbNxZ+Jmz=k1O3EqhYY5o0ex9Q at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Crispin,
>
> You are echoing what I have said for years. All fuels are dirty -it is the
> combustion that makes them clean. With good combustion kerosene becomes an
> excellent fuel. For those with other agenda it will always be a dirty fuel!
>
> Just to refresh the memories I will suggest stovers to look at two
> articles. www.nariphaltan.org/kerosene.pdf
>
> http://www.thebetterindia.com/16136/lamp-stove-solving-rural-india-biggest-problems-lanstove-grassroot-innovation/
>
> Cheers.
>
> Anil
>
> On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 7:19 AM, Crispin Pemberton-Pigott <
> crispinpigott at outlook.com> wrote:
>
>> Dear AD
>>
>> LPG is a wonderful fuel for those who can get it and pay for it. Because
>> of cost, kerosene was heavily subsidised in Indonesia. It became so
>> expensive when the price of oil was run up that the subsidy was literally
>> bankrupting? the country. They tried to raise the price and there were
>> riots.
>>
>> So they embarked on the only other viable plan: to switch their subsidy to
>> LPG but at a lower level.
>>
>> This was accomplished in a total of 4 ye?ars, I believe. Some 40 million
>> stoves were given away. Recently Cecil Cook and the WB social science team
>> led by Helen Carlsson discovered that 70% of the poor people 'cooking with
>> wood' also used LPG at least part of the time.
>>
>> Cecil found it is used for very particular tasks which fit the description
>> you gave below - largely for quick cooking and reheating of food, making
>> tea and when the pots should remain clean.
>>
>> Problems emerged last year when the budget allocation ?for LPG and
>> gasoline (which sells for $0.66 a litre) ran out long before year end. Same
>> problem as before : rising energy prices.
>>
>> Now that there is a determined effort to drive the international price of
>> oil down, perhaps they get a reprieve for a while, but the fact remains, to
>> give access to LPG it has to be subsidised. Otherwise they will use more
>> wood.
>>
>> It is not a matter of one of the other, people use both, but the switch to
>> wood is immediate if the price rises.
>>
>> Globally there is a shortage of LPG. Thus pressure on the price will
>> remain. Part of the price is a relatively expensive delivery ?cost as every
>> aspect of it is regulated and has to be very safe. I say that with kerosene
>> in mind which is far cheaper to distribute. It can also be loaned or sold
>> to a neighbour on a small scale.
>>
>> Both can be burned extremely cleanly so it is a disappointment to see the
>> WHO refer to kerosene as a 'dirty fuel' in need of being removed from all
>> homes. A stove that cannot burn it properly is the guilty party, not 'a
>> fuel'.
>>
>> Regards
>> Crispin
>>
>>
>> Dear List,
>> I saw recently a lot of criticism against LPG. As cooking fuel, it is
>> really superb, giving a blue flame without smoke or soot,
>> instantaneous ignition, finger-tip control of flame intensity, no ash,
>> etc. Being liquifiable, relatively large quantities of it can be
>> filled into cylinders which occupy very little space in the kitchen.
>> One can carry the cylinder around if the gas is needed elsewhere. I
>> understand that LPG is a by product of petroleum refining and that one
>> cannot avoid the production of LPG as long as we are using petroleum
>> and refining it. So, if we stopped using it as cooking fuel, we shall
>> have to find an alternative use for it.
>> Yours
>> A.D.Karve
>> ***
>> Dr. A.D. Karve
>>
>> Chairman, Samuchit Enviro Tech Pvt Ltd (www.samuchit.com)
>>
>> Trustee & Founder President, Appropriate Rural Technology Institute (ARTI)
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Stoves mailing list
>>
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>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
>>
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>>
>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
>>
>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Stoves mailing list
>>
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>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Nimbkar Agricultural Research Institute (NARI)
> Tambmal, Phaltan-Lonand Road
> P.O.Box 44
> Phaltan-415523, Maharashtra, India
> Ph:91-2166-222396/220945/222842
> e-mail:nariphaltan at gmail.com
> nariphaltan at nariphaltan.org
>
> http://www.nariphaltan.org
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2014 08:02:07 +0200
> From: "Philip Lloyd" <plloyd at mweb.co.za>
> To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'"
> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Is LPG all that bad?
> Message-ID: <008b01d00d2c$56b44040$041cc0c0$@co.za>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Yes, indeed LPG is a wonderful fuel. It is very clean, fast, and can be made quite affordable. You have to teach people how to use it effectively, but they soon learn. In Cape Town there is a major roll-out, with some 200 000 households now being serviced with supply points within 500m of the homes. Most use 5kg cylinders which is sufficient for 1 month?s cooking. It is not subsidized in any way, yet it competes well with electricity which is subsidized to the tune of 50kWh free a month. Some use cheap single burners, but most prefer 2-, 3- or 4-burner cookstoves which cost less than $200.
>
>
>
> Part of the driver for this was the finding some years ago that replacing 100 000 electric cookers with LPG trimmed 40MW off the peak power demand. It was the most successful intervention during a power supply crisis. However, the LPG supply logistics at the time were poor. Soon LPG supplies ran out, and people reverted to other fuels.
>
>
>
> Prof Philip Lloyd
>
> Energy Institute
>
> Cape Peninsula University of Technology
>
> PO Box 652, Cape Town 8000
>
> Tel:021 460 4216
>
> Fax:021 460 3828
>
> Cell: 083 441 5247
>
>
>
> From: Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org] On Behalf Of Crispin Pemberton-Pigott
> Sent: 01 December 2014 03:49
> To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Is LPG all that bad?
>
>
>
> Dear AD
>
>
>
>
>
> LPG is a wonderful fuel for those who can get it and pay for it. Because of cost, kerosene was heavily subsidised in Indonesia. It became so expensive when the price of oil was run up that the subsidy was literally bankrupting? the country. They tried to raise the price and there were riots.
>
>
>
>
>
> So they embarked on the only other viable plan: to switch their subsidy to LPG but at a lower level.
>
>
>
>
>
> This was accomplished in a total of 4 ye?ars, I believe. Some 40 million stoves were given away. Recently Cecil Cook and the WB social science team led by Helen Carlsson discovered that 70% of the poor people 'cooking with wood' also used LPG at least part of the time.
>
>
>
>
>
> Cecil found it is used for very particular tasks which fit the description you gave below - largely for quick cooking and reheating of food, making tea and when the pots should remain clean.
>
>
>
>
>
> Problems emerged last year when the budget allocation ?for LPG and gasoline (which sells for $0.66 a litre) ran out long before year end. Same problem as before : rising energy prices.
>
>
>
>
>
> Now that there is a determined effort to drive the international price of oil down, perhaps they get a reprieve for a while, but the fact remains, to give access to LPG it has to be subsidised. Otherwise they will use more wood.
>
>
>
>
>
> It is not a matter of one of the other, people use both, but the switch to wood is immediate if the price rises.
>
>
>
>
>
> Globally there is a shortage of LPG. Thus pressure on the price will remain. Part of the price is a relatively expensive delivery ?cost as every aspect of it is regulated and has to be very safe. I say that with kerosene in mind which is far cheaper to distribute. It can also be loaned or sold to a neighbour on a small scale.
>
>
>
>
>
> Both can be burned extremely cleanly so it is a disappointment to see the WHO refer to kerosene as a 'dirty fuel' in need of being removed from all homes. A stove that cannot burn it properly is the guilty party, not 'a fuel'.
>
>
>
>
>
> Regards
>
> Crispin
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Dear List,
>
> I saw recently a lot of criticism against LPG. As cooking fuel, it is
> really superb, giving a blue flame without smoke or soot,
> instantaneous ignition, finger-tip control of flame intensity, no ash,
> etc. Being liquifiable, relatively large quantities of it can be
> filled into cylinders which occupy very little space in the kitchen.
> One can carry the cylinder around if the gas is needed elsewhere. I
> understand that LPG is a by product of petroleum refining and that one
> cannot avoid the production of LPG as long as we are using petroleum
> and refining it. So, if we stopped using it as cooking fuel, we shall
> have to find an alternative use for it.
> Yours
> A.D.Karve
> ***
> Dr. A.D. Karve
>
> Chairman, Samuchit Enviro Tech Pvt Ltd (www.samuchit.com)
>
> Trustee & Founder President, Appropriate Rural Technology Institute (ARTI)
>
> _______________________________________________
> Stoves mailing list
>
> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
>
> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
>
> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2014 11:57:38 +0530
> From: Saloop T S <t.s.saloop at gmail.com>
> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Is LPG all that bad?
> Message-ID:
> <CA+B1WDMcSNnpQ=kALpsDx=ktoFkvuz9f9606exT6UxYfLwY5gw at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Respected People,
> It is true that LPG is the best available option today we have
> as a cooking fuel, giving around 60-65 % efficiency and cleaner fuel. But
> for a developing country like India having 123 million rural households
> depending on biomass as cooking fuel, LPG is not the best solution.
> Improved biomass cookstove with higher efficiency and lesser emission at
> minimum cost is the best option, according to me.
>
> Thank you,
> On Dec 1, 2014 11:33 AM, "Philip Lloyd" <plloyd at mweb.co.za> wrote:
>
>> Yes, indeed LPG is a wonderful fuel. It is very clean, fast, and can be
>> made quite affordable. You have to teach people how to use it effectively,
>> but they soon learn. In Cape Town there is a major roll-out, with some 200
>> 000 households now being serviced with supply points within 500m of the
>> homes. Most use 5kg cylinders which is sufficient for 1 month's cooking.
>> It is not subsidized in any way, yet it competes well with electricity
>> which is subsidized to the tune of 50kWh free a month. Some use cheap
>> single burners, but most prefer 2-, 3- or 4-burner cookstoves which cost
>> less than $200.
>>
>>
>>
>> Part of the driver for this was the finding some years ago that replacing
>> 100 000 electric cookers with LPG trimmed 40MW off the peak power demand.
>> It was the most successful intervention during a power supply crisis.
>> However, the LPG supply logistics at the time were poor. Soon LPG supplies
>> ran out, and people reverted to other fuels.
>>
>>
>>
>> Prof Philip Lloyd
>>
>> Energy Institute
>>
>> Cape Peninsula University of Technology
>>
>> PO Box 652, Cape Town 8000
>>
>> Tel:021 460 4216
>>
>> Fax:021 460 3828
>>
>> Cell: 083 441 5247
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org] *On
>> Behalf Of *Crispin Pemberton-Pigott
>> *Sent:* 01 December 2014 03:49
>> *To:* stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
>> *Subject:* Re: [Stoves] Is LPG all that bad?
>>
>>
>>
>> Dear AD
>>
>>
>>
>> LPG is a wonderful fuel for those who can get it and pay for it. Because
>> of cost, kerosene was heavily subsidised in Indonesia. It became so
>> expensive when the price of oil was run up that the subsidy was literally
>> bankrupting the country. They tried to raise the price and there were
>> riots.
>>
>>
>>
>> So they embarked on the only other viable plan: to switch their subsidy to
>> LPG but at a lower level.
>>
>>
>>
>> This was accomplished in a total of 4 years, I believe. Some 40 million
>> stoves were given away. Recently Cecil Cook and the WB social science team
>> led by Helen Carlsson discovered that 70% of the poor people 'cooking with
>> wood' also used LPG at least part of the time.
>>
>>
>>
>> Cecil found it is used for very particular tasks which fit the description
>> you gave below - largely for quick cooking and reheating of food, making
>> tea and when the pots should remain clean.
>>
>>
>>
>> Problems emerged last year when the budget allocation for LPG and
>> gasoline (which sells for $0.66 a litre) ran out long before year end.
>> Same problem as before : rising energy prices.
>>
>>
>>
>> Now that there is a determined effort to drive the international price of
>> oil down, perhaps they get a reprieve for a while, but the fact remains, to
>> give access to LPG it has to be subsidised. Otherwise they will use more
>> wood.
>>
>>
>>
>> It is not a matter of one of the other, people use both, but the switch to
>> wood is immediate if the price rises.
>>
>>
>>
>> Globally there is a shortage of LPG. Thus pressure on the price will
>> remain. Part of the price is a relatively expensive delivery cost as
>> every aspect of it is regulated and has to be very safe. I say that with
>> kerosene in mind which is far cheaper to distribute. It can also be loaned
>> or sold to a neighbour on a small scale.
>>
>>
>>
>> Both can be burned extremely cleanly so it is a disappointment to see the
>> WHO refer to kerosene as a 'dirty fuel' in need of being removed from all
>> homes. A stove that cannot burn it properly is the guilty party, not 'a
>> fuel'.
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Crispin
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Dear List,
>>
>> I saw recently a lot of criticism against LPG. As cooking fuel, it is
>> really superb, giving a blue flame without smoke or soot,
>> instantaneous ignition, finger-tip control of flame intensity, no ash,
>> etc. Being liquifiable, relatively large quantities of it can be
>> filled into cylinders which occupy very little space in the kitchen.
>> One can carry the cylinder around if the gas is needed elsewhere. I
>> understand that LPG is a by product of petroleum refining and that one
>> cannot avoid the production of LPG as long as we are using petroleum
>> and refining it. So, if we stopped using it as cooking fuel, we shall
>> have to find an alternative use for it.
>> Yours
>> A.D.Karve
>> ***
>> Dr. A.D. Karve
>>
>> Chairman, Samuchit Enviro Tech Pvt Ltd (www.samuchit.com)
>>
>> Trustee & Founder President, Appropriate Rural Technology Institute (ARTI)
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Stoves mailing list
>>
>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
>>
>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
>>
>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
>>
>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Stoves mailing list
>>
>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
>>
>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
>>
>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
>>
>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
>>
>>
>>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2014 01:47:27 -0500
> From: "d.michael.shafer at gmail.com" <d.michael.shafer at gmail.com>
> To: "Ronal W. Larson" <rongretlarson at comcast.net>
> Cc: Discussion of biomass <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Very interesting Stove (Thailand?)
> Message-ID:
> <CAOoKntc9xGmwqzZVp17_hECoGdwKt=p=02ZHh9-T-cdS9oJVkQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I have my chief of staff looking at the video. I'll report back if there is
> anything interesting in the discussion.
>
> M
>
> Michael Shafer
> www.warmheartworldwide.org
> www.twitter.com/warmheartorg
> http://www.facebook.com/warmheartworldwide
> <http://www.youtube.com/warmheartvideo>
> http://greatnonprofits.org/organizations/view/warm-heart-worldwide-inc
>
> On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 12:57 PM, Ronal W. Larson <rongretlarson at comcast.net
>> wrote:
>
>> Paul cc List and Michael:
>>
>> 1. I thought you had a good summary.
>>
>> 2. I'd like to know more about the insulation - a portion seemed
>> combustible. but apparently not.
>>
>> 3. Also an interesting set of pots. Seemed the main cooking utensils sat
>> inside a wok. Heat transfer via conduction; kept pot clean, but no chance
>> for a skirt.
>>
>> 4. I was surprised that there seemed to be no careful placement of fuel.
>> 5. I could get a translation of the 41 comments - but saw nothing
>> useful - except there seemed to be a University connection.
>>
>> Ron
>>
>>
>> On Nov 29, 2014, at 9:46 AM, Paul Anderson <psanders at ilstu.edu> wrote:
>>
>> Roberto and all,
>>
>> I agree that it is an interesting video about a somewhat different
>> variation of TLUD stoves. To save all some time, I give you these notes:
>>
>> 1. Yes, probably Thailand, but not clearly indicated. All dialog and
>> text could not be understood, except that it was filmed at a research
>> center for ag machinery.
>>
>> 2. 24 minutes is LOOONG. I suggest you load it and then see these
>> selections:
>>
>> 3. Gets interesting about the details of the stove in minutes 6 through
>> 10. You will see a large square metal tin and two concentric cylinders.
>> VERY Interesting use of 2 crossing rods at minute 8:30 to space the three
>> containers and to support the grate.
>>
>> 4. Minutes 13:00 to 17+ show the use of insulation (seems to be ash from
>> rice husks) between the outer square can and the next cylinder, including
>> how to seal it off (wet ash with rice husks).
>>
>> 5. There is no attempt to limit the primary air. It is free flowing
>> all the time. [IMO, this aspect could be improved, and it seems that the
>> developers were rather on their own about the design of the stove. But we
>> know that new experiments and designs can bring progress, and are glad to
>> see this TLUD development. ]
>>
>> 6. Secondary air enters via several (4 or 6, I think) sets of three holes
>> (arranged vertically about 2 cm apart) in the innermost cylinder (the fuel
>> chamber). The sets of holes are about 5 (?) cm below the top of the fuel
>> cylinder, therefore giving some drafting. Otherwise, there is no riser on
>> the unit. And not concentrator disk.
>>
>> 7. Near the end (about minutes 20 and later) you can see the stove in
>> operation. Seems to work nicely. Apart from measuring the flame
>> temperature there is not testing shown in the video.
>>
>> 8. If anyone has access to Thai speakers, please confirm or correct the
>> above message.
>>
>> Thank you to Roberto (who is in Chile) for finding this and calling it to
>> our attention. I will consider how to present my comments and the video
>> link at my drtlud.com website.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>> Doc / Dr TLUD / Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
>> Email: psanders at ilstu.edu
>> Skype: paultlud Phone: +1-309-452-7072
>> Website: www.drtlud.com
>>
>> On 11/29/2014 8:47 AM, Roberto Poehlmann wrote:
>>
>> This is a very interesting video of a tlud stove (fabrication and
>> operation).
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4YrII8GcOsc
>>
>>
>>
>> Roberto
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2014 10:04:26 -0200
> From: Rogerio carneiro de miranda <carneirodemiranda at gmail.com>
> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] wood stove with vitroceramic griddle
> Message-ID:
> <CADB_T=h1zROwq7p1wtdMcXdq3y5cWBjf2OC__YGdcyygUd12wg at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> AJH
>
> Generally these stoves has an oven attached, so there is demand for extra
> energy, and also water heater coil.
>
> The usage of such stoves are mostly for recreation, e.g., weekend cooking
> with family and friends at a separate room in the house.
>
> Rog?rio
>
> 2014-11-29 9:52 GMT-02:00 <ajheggie at gmail.com>:
>
>> [Default] On Fri, 28 Nov 2014 15:41:51 -0600,Paul Anderson
>> <psanders at ilstu.edu> wrote:
>>
>>> Rogerio,
>>>
>>> Very nice!! I went to the company website www.antonow.com.br and
>>> saw a full line of beautiful woodburning stoves. Not just limited to
>>> the vitroceramic.
>>
>> Interesting, especially the setting.
>>
>> I thought the logs were much too large and the fire far to close to
>> the "plancha". Was heat being utilised further downstream? If the
>> vitroceramic were a good conductor it would be quenching the flame, if
>> not then was heat being wasted?
>>
>> These queries do not detract from the material of course, I have a
>> similar ceramic hob at home but with electric elements under it . I've
>> always preferred an open gas flame for the (very minimal) cooking I
>> do.
>>
>> AJH
>>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2014 12:25:10 -0500
> From: Crispin Pemberton-Pigott <crispinpigott at outlook.com>
> To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'"
> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> Subject: [Stoves] Toxic wood
> Message-ID: <COL401-EAS3275F42B616AB8911B93A15B17D0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Dear Friends
>
>
>
> I was researching some toxic wood fuels. Might as well share.
>
>
>
> http://www.wood-database.com/wood-articles/wood-allergies-and-toxicity/
>
> http://worldagroforestry.org/newsroom/highlights/good-bad-and-toxic-fuel-woo
> ds-trees-farms-make-difference
>
>
>
> I swear Cunningham speaks SiSwati!
>
>
>
> Regards
>
> Crispin, ukhuluma kancane
>
>
>
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