[Stoves] Starting stoves

Mon Jan 6 13:44:01 CST 2014

Paul and all,

<snip>

One comment now:   The special starter needs to be in some appropriate
contact with the fuel.    Under piles of sticks (tinder, etc) in a
stick-fire could work fine.    On top of a pile of fuel in a TLUD can be
great, but needs some additional comments.  

Probably should have a small amount of the raw fuel mixed in or on top of
the starter?    This works well with pellet fuels and other fuels that have
sufficiently small size to fill in any voids between the fuel pieces.
However.......

Be careful of gaps between pieces of larger fuel such as vertical sticks or
corn cobs, because the starter could fall down and the ignite the raw fuel
too far down in the fuel bed.

[Frank >] Paul - of all the people on this list you would know best. If well
running stoves produce little particular matter and most is produced when
starting, is that PM produced when starting still enough to create problems
needed to be dealt with? Perhaps not. But if it is..

My multi-fuel camp stoves lights with no smoke. You use alcohol to start
your TLUD and, I think, promote that starting method using alcohol for the
stoves you sell. It seems a matter of seamlessly transition from an alcohol
burner to wood gas burner where no smoke is produced -is the goal. Perhaps
an iris lens structure that starts closed burning alcohol then is opened as
wood gas and increased gas volume is added to the secondary. As for the
char; I know much less butane is adsorbed when the temperature of the char
is high so am thinking gas will be released when loaded char is re-heated.
Much research needed if this is a necessary goal. 

I am not really saying anything - just thinking how one might lower PM
during Start -IF- that is really needed. 

I will not be at ETHOS and suddenly becoming real busy and might not make
Aprovacho. 

Thanks

Frank

Note:   Presented months ago, but not widely discussed, is the use of
Regular char (not the starter stuff) to fill in the gaps when using larger
pieces of fuel.    I have tried that several times, always with reasonable
success.    The char-as-filler is essentially "inert" as the pyrolysis front
of the TLUD passes downward, creating more char (and leaving the filler char
re-heated but probably not modified).   (no char is lost in this re-use of
the previously created char.).

Frank, see you at ETHOS and after !!!!!!!!

Paul

Doc  /  Dr TLUD  /  Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD  
Email:  psanders at ilstu.edu   
Skype: paultlud      Phone: +1-309-452-7072
Website:  www.drtlud.com

On 1/2/2014 3:56 PM, Frank Shields wrote:

Dear All,

It seems most stoves work very cleanly once started. It's the starting that
produces the most particular matter and poor combustion and the part of the
process that needs improving upon. 

I think that means when we light the match we need a fast, hot flame
produced from a well-mixed gas in the exact ratio for combustion and next to
a material that burns hot. 

I do not understand this process (cannot visualize it) but activated carbon
has a butane activity of ~30 g per 100 grams carbon. A good Biochar has
around 10g/100grams. 30g butane = ~12 liters gas and 10g = ~4 liters gas all
'packed' into a cup of char. And char burns very hot. So wondering if loaded
char could be used as a fire starter? So one can squeeze 12 liters butane
gas into a cup of Biochar (?!?!!) using no pressure etc.  

Char having high activation (> 10) I have loaded with gasoline and have a
tank of methane ready for testing when I get the time.  

The next improvement might be a better way to light the stove. I was
thinking a Wile E. Coyote mechanical detonator where one pushes a plunger
that creates a spark within the packed fuel to ignite something (loaded
char?).  

<http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_wpcJX2WqAXo/S06hLGzpHgI/AAAAAAAAAJY/t-fip6bv-nI/s
400/coyote-6.jpg>
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_wpcJX2WqAXo/S06hLGzpHgI/AAAAAAAAAJY/t-fip6bv-nI/s4
00/coyote-6.jpg

 <http://brassgoggles.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=printpage;topic=780.0>
http://brassgoggles.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=printpage;topic=780.0

I plan to bring some high activity biochar loaded with a couple things to
Aprovacho (after Ethos) and hope we have the time to experiment with using
it for igniting fuel.  

Regards

Frank

Frank Shields

Control Laboratories; Inc.

42 Hangar Way

Watsonville, CA  95076

(831) 724-5422 tel

(831) 724-3188 fax

 <mailto:frank at biocharlab.com> frank at biocharlab.com

 <http://www.controllabs.com> www.controllabs.com

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