[Stoves] [biochar] Re: A review of chronological development in cookstove assessment methods: Challenges and way forward [1 Attachment]

Thu Nov 26 13:11:09 CST 2015

Hi Ron

Once upon a dark and stormy November night, the cat went to the door and meowed to be let out. The Master opened the door, but the cat immediately turned around and refused to go out.

A minute later, the cat went to another door, meowed again, and when it saw the bad weather again, refused to go out again.

A few minutes later the cat again meowed, at a third door.

The Master did not arise to open the third door, because he deduced that the cat was looking for “The Door to Summer”.

From: biochar at yahoogroups.com [mailto:biochar at yahoogroups.com] 
Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2015 11:10 AM
To: Discussion of biomass <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>; Crispin Pemberton-Pigott <crispinpigott at outlook.com>
Cc: Biochar <biochar at yahoogroups.com>; Entire Group <biocharstoves-7xpll at wiggiomail.com>; biochar at googlegroups.com
Subject: [biochar] Re: [Stoves] A review of chronological development in cookstove assessment methods: Challenges and way forward [1 Attachment]

[Attachment(s) from Ronal W. Larson included below] 

Crispin and lists (some added)

            Yours is a perfect example of my complaint.    

            Apparently you believe that the inefficiency of this stove  (which I would call a wonderful stove) is 1- .334 = .666 (66.6%).   I disagree- that is not the inefficiency.  If you have a different perception of the word “inefficiency” - what is it?  Please give your view on inefficiency (NOT efficiency) for this specific example - which is amazingly close to the example I gave to start this thread (almost 30% char!!)

            I sure wish you had supplied a cite, so I could look further into the testing.  I have no way of knowing from this test anything about the char - which this stove was clearly trying to produce.  Jim Jetter does enough post testing to give us that number.  One might assume you don’t know, since it is not given (and would be of considerable interest to anyone buying this stove.  But to get your 12.81 MJ/kg (four significant figures !!) in the fuel consumed, you must have the char energy content to the same accuracy.

            I also have to question the computations.  How can I find how you got the numbers of 12.81 MJ/kg.  Do you really believe you know that to 4 significant figures? What was the fuel moisture content and how recently measured?

            Why is 2.1 kW a “Fail”?  Sounds pretty good to me.   Is this due to the same reasoning that causes a CSI rating of only two stars?  Would the EPA methodology give this two stars?

            Whew!  I still have to “commend” you for trying so hard to convince the world that biochar and char-making stoves make no sense.  But your commenting on the word “inefficiency” for this particular stove would still be helpful to a few of us.  And letting us know who did this testing - and where to read about the procedures.

Ron 

On Nov 25, 2015, at 10:25 PM, Crispin Pemberton-Pigott <crispinpigott at outlook.com <mailto:crispinpigott at outlook.com> > wrote:

Dear Ron

In case you are under the impression that people are not reporting the mass of char produced, here is a sample of a stove test using the CSI method.

Regards

Crispin

<image001.jpg>

Art and ccs

              Another message from you a little later said you would be creating (I think) a place to archive this series on how to report on TLUDs in a consistent and helpful way.  Thanks for that.

[snip]

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Posted by: Ronal W. Larson <rongretlarson at comcast.net <mailto:rongretlarson at comcast.net> > 

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