[Stoves] report with disappointing results from cleaner cookstoves

Jock Gill jock at jockgill.com
Tue Dec 13 07:54:01 CST 2016


The problem I see is that we are too focused on stove technology. We are not looking at the context in which the problems exist. My view is that little progress will be made until we reject and replace most, if not all, of the 20th century "zombie" ideologies. These zombies create a framework that essentially prevents the necessary political, economic, and social changes that would allow better stoves to play a constructive role in solving the problems created by these very same zombies. The voters in the US clearly rejected more of the same old same old. However, the only real choice they had was a backwards view offering a return to a simulacrum of an imagined 18th century.  I have yet to see a vibrant and dynamic vision of a regenerative 21st century. Clearly, the Democratic Party failed to offer such a vision as an alternative to the offering made by team Trump.  And now we will all pay the price for this failure to create and offer a forward looking vision.  Better stoves will come into their own only when  such a vision is articulated and adopted very widely.

Jock Gill
P. O. Box 3
Peacham, VT 05862

Cell: (617) 449-8111

Disrupt the present for a Regenerative Future

Instagram: jockgill 

> On Dec 12, 2016, at 9:35 AM, Xavier Brandao <xvr.brandao at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Tom,
> Closing the list? I'd be curious to know who had this brilliant idea.
> That'd be terrible, this is the space where we can find truly helpful information. This list has helped a lot of people. Much more than any webinar or conference/workshop ever did. Freedom of speech has its flaws, but among rants and negative emotions, there are some ideas too.
> I still think we can use freedom of speech discuss on this list with patience, without too much anger or scorn.
> 
> Nikhil,
> I can understand your frustration, but we don't know about the motives of the people behind this study, the way they think, the way they work. Rather than "qualify" them, I would really focus on their work, and on the scientific debate: did they screw up? Did they do a bad job? Where and why?
> 
> You are sure about the fact that a methodology where 3 groups in each village using only and for a given length of time traditional stove, or improved woodstove, or electric plates, wouldn't at all allow to prove or have a fairly good assumption that cleaner cooking does exist, and has a positive impact on health (may it be pneumonia or other diseases)?
> If not, why?
> 
> Gentlemen and women,
> I think for the sake of clarity, we should really put this simply. And we should start interacting with the study authors.
> People on this list question the study methodology:
> Assumption 1: there is a lot more to health than pneumonia.
> Question 1 for the study authors: what do they think? Can cookstoves be cleaner, their use healthier than traditional stoves? They said some users noticed they were coughing less? How important is that, in terms of health?
> Assumption 2: there is a lot more to pneumonia than just the smoky cooking device, there is malnutrition for example.
> Action 1: what are the scientific papers which back up this assumption?
> Question 2 for the study authors: didn't they know there was a lot more to pneumonia than just the cooking device? If so, then why such a methodology? Don't they think their results prove nothing?"
> Has one of us started to talk with them? If not, should one of us do so?
> We need to start this conversation, if we want to be going somewhere. We need to ask clarifications, present arguments, they will counter-argument, etc. etc. This is how a sound scientific debate 
> And this is how, collectively, we can agree on the right methodology for the next million-dollar health study to measure impact that we can be sure will happen in the future.
> Instead, alas, of funding R&D to make cleaner stoves.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Xavier
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