[Stoves] New kind of Sawdust stove

[Ronald Hongsermeier]

Now I see that the note I had been composing with the falsely posited 
question about the nature of the correct taxonomy of the stove hadn't 
been sent. I asked the question : "Isn't this a TLDD?" but was mistaken 
in some of my photo interpretation. This confusion/mistakenness 
hopefully corrected... LOL on me.

Ronald von daisteinekuhindernähediesesflachenstein(es)



On 25.10.2016 04:51, Crispin Pemberton-Pigott wrote:
> Dear Paul
>
> Discussions with you on terminology are always entertaining.
>
> The 'draft' part of the terminology does not refer to the air flow it 
> refers to the gas flow.
>
> You are trying to turn a direction of the gas into a direction of the 
> air through the fuel‎.
>
>
> Nurhuda's wood stove and Prime's pellet stove (both designed by 
> Nurhuda) are TLUD's not because the wood stove has air cross-drafting 
> into the fuel, nor because the ‎pellet stove has air updrafting in a 
> tube, then cross-drafting into the fuel.
>
> They are TLUD,s because gases produced in the fuel are updrafted and 
> combusted vertically above the fuel.
>
> A crossdraft combusted has a horizontal flame. Examples are the 
> Japanese FLOX burners, oil furnaces, GTZ 7 Series (now TJ4 and KG4) 
> and a lot of tube boilers.
>
> An end lit cross draft ELCD is a type of solid fuel crossdraft 
> including the TJ1 and 2, plus the ‎MM2 Mongolian 'traditional' stove.
>
> The characteristic of the fuel being lit on top and the draft ‎pulling 
> the flame up and away from the fuel makes it top lit (according to 
> where it is lit) and updraft (according to the direction of the 
> gas/flames).
>
> The argument that the direction of the air arriving at the combustion 
> site doesn't fly. ‎One would have to recategorize oil furnaces with 
> horizontal flames and horizontal exits depending on whether the air 
> arrived and met the fuel from below, or above, or the side.
>
> Would a Vesto be a downdraft stove? Of course not, the flames are 
> upwards. It is always updraft.  Can it be operated as bottom lit or 
> top lit? ‎Of course. In top lit mode ALL the air is provided from the 
> side and none from below.
>
> A TLUD pyrolyser can be operated on its side. That makes it a cross 
> draft pyrolyser. Similarly it can be operated upside down (town gas) 
> in which case it is a bottom lit downdraft pyrolyser. BLDD.
>
> A good example of changing the air is that a BLDD gasifier can have 
> all the primary air arriving right at the grate from the side. None of 
> the air passes through the fuel.
>
> In the case of the TJ4 the air is all from below and the pyrolysis 
> starts on the bottom of the grate. This allows the stove to burn dust 
> and chips which completely block the air passing through the fuel load.
>
> Altanbek has achieved the same thing: the fuel doesn't permit air to 
> flow through it but has nonetheless achieved a top lit updraft flame. 
> I can't say no one did this before, but certainly I haven't seen one 
> before.
>
> Regards
> Crispin
>
>
>
> Crispin,      (with apologies to everyone else.)
>
> Come on Crispin, get off it.  You are just causing confusion regarding 
> the estabilished terminology!!!   It is easy to mis-use words and 
> descriptive acronyms, but you of all people should know better about 
> what TLUD signifies.   Do not put yourself down with such silly talk!!
>
> Besides, in your next message (addressed to Andrew and the Listserv), 
> YOU wrote:
>> It looks and acts like a TLUD but has zero air coming from below.
> How can you imply that "zero air coming from below" is somehow an "up 
> draft"?   And then to call it a TLUD?
>
> You are a friend and very talented, but get real.  Please stop 
> confusing the terminology that is getting accepted and understood.
>
> There can be up draft stoves and top lit stoves.   But the acronym 
> "TLUD" is something quite specific, and the migratory pyrolytic front 
> (MPF) is its very distinctive characteristic. If MPF is not clearly 
> evident, a stove should not be called a TLUD.
>
> Enough.   I hope there is silence about this subject.  But do go ahead 
> and talk about the new kind of Sawdust stove.
>
> Paul‎
>
>
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