[Stoves] China and cookstoves -- stove history

lh cheng lhkind at gmail.com
Fri Dec 1 17:37:21 MST 2017


There are many people spread lies for the Chinese regime, they are called
"50 cents" by netizens, hundreds of thousands of them( a large number? yes
). this is a part of many lies in China. so distinguish any information
from China for yourselves, Dear stovers.

2017-12-02 1:27 GMT+08:00 Todd Albi <todd.r.albi at gmail.com>:

> This is an older (pre-bronze) pottery stoves, perhaps used for drying a
> small amount of tea leaves or heating tea.  This is thought to be from the
> Xia Dynasty, unearthed near Xuzhou.  The protrusion to far left is the
> chimney on the stove.  The larger cup appears to be where maybe tea leaves
> were dried, and the higher firepower ports were used for heating water?
> Perhaps stove on right uses one port for heating water and the other
> formerly had the chimney Ito the rear, now missing?  Just non-scholarly
> guesses on my part.
>
>
> ​Apologize, but it was not possible to get any information or better
> photographs of these stoves.  They were not accessible and at the back of
> the exhibits.  The other items appeared to be of more important historical
> significance.  Maybe Shell, GACC, EPA, or others would like to fund efforts
> for me to attempt to document some of this history.
>
> Todd Albi, SilverFire
>>
> On Thu, Nov 30, 2017 at 11:19 PM, <hfyblx at 163.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>>
>>
>> I have to apologize for having been absent from the conversation here for
>> a long time. I have been struggling with my prelim since early this year if
>> this is kind of excuse…
>>
>>
>>
>> The public kitchen movement is a product of ambitious growth goal that
>> was set by the Chinese government (Great Leap Forward) back in the earlier
>> years after the establishment of People’s republic of China. The
>> government wanted to increase the steel production to beat the US and UK by
>> having the small steel furnace built in lots of the villages. However, back
>> then, there was not much iron mine in China due to the weak heavy industry
>> and there was no way that the village would get access to the raw material
>> for steel industry, not even mention that the production process applied
>> could not make steel, but only some metal craps. As a result, all the iron
>> woks in each house had to donate to the local “blast furnace” which
>> consumed lots of local wood and biomass source (another story) as energy.
>> That is the reason why it was not allowed to cook food in single family,
>> instead, people all ate in the public kitchen.
>>
>>
>>
>> Disasters came along pretty soon. Both natural cause and artificial
>> cause, natural cause account for 30% and government policy account for 70%
>> (quoted from the website of The history of the people’s republic of
>> China). Food storage went down very fast and people died of starvation (10
>> million based on the same website and there is no way I can find whether it
>> is true or not). My dad and mom were born right around that three years and
>> they were lucky.
>>
>>
>>
>> 1500 RMB for a stove, especially heavy heating stove is a common price I
>> would say, while in the 1990s, the price was only 400 RMB. Prices are all
>> relative. Back to the day when my parents got married, they can still
>> afford that 400 RMB heating stove, accounting for less than 1/10 of annual
>> income. There are poorer people and richer people all over the world, every
>> county. Objectively speaking, the price of the stove in China is reasonable
>> and government has done a lot to distribute the stoves to the project area
>> (part of the poverty alleviation policy) at low cost or no cost for the
>> receivers. The government will pay for the stove and the receivers only
>> need to pay 50 RMB or so for delivery, so far as I know by doing the
>> investigation in Shanxi, Hubei province supported by Shell foundation.
>> Things might be different in other places but for the project areas, the
>> receivers don’t need to pay for the stove that distributed by the
>> project, that is for sure.
>>
>>
>>
>> During that investigation, I’ve seen stoves that were sent to the houses
>> in the project conducted several years ago. I have to say, some of them
>> were stored like new in the backyard and had never been used due to all the
>> barriers realized by the researchers. However, some of them were in very
>> poor conditions because of everyday wear and tear in the past three or four
>> years.
>>
>>
>>
>> But with all the words above, I need to say stove technology is the key
>> to answer the question from a technical point of view like how to increase
>> the performance and how to make TLUD produce less smoke during ignition
>> period and ending period by modifying the dimension and fuel compatibility.
>> The studies that evaluate the stove projects will inform us all the
>> barriers to improved stove adoption and all the great experience during
>> each success stove dissemination. All the effort from the stove community
>> should be appreciated.
>>
>>
>>
>> I have never experienced the bleak years and all my information came from
>> my parents and my grandparents so please correct me if any story was buried
>> in the history. After all, China is a vast country, similar size to the US,
>> everything is possible.
>>
>>
>>
>> By the way, stove DIY is something done years ago in China. People living
>> in the villages made their Zaos ( a type of common old stove in China, In
>> English maybe hearths?) by themselves or hire the mason to do that if they
>> don’t know how to make a good one. In this way, good masons can make
>> stoves with less smoke and less energy use, then words spread and that is
>> how masons made a living.
>>
>>
>>
>> Best wishes
>>
>>
>>
>> Jacky
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
>> Windows 10
>>
>>
>>
>> *From: *lh cheng <lhkind at gmail.com>
>> *Sent: *Thursday, November 30, 2017 8:39 PM
>> *To: *Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
>> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
>> *Subject: *Re: [Stoves] China and cookstoves -- stove history
>>
>>
>>
>> Dear Dr,
>>
>> there is very little information in English about that, not even in
>> Chinese. I am afraid I can't provide more.:( Smoke and stove is a very
>> important causation, superficial though. yes, China has moved on since
>> those bleak years of 1959-61.  but the  regime never admitted it, let
>> alone apologize for it. research or evidence collecting is not welcomed.
>> and I need to break GFW to contact with you now in 2017.
>>
>>
>>
>> regards
>>
>>
>>
>> 2017-12-01 12:02 GMT+08:00 Paul Anderson <psanders at ilstu.edu>:
>>
>> Cheng,
>>
>> I am learning a lot.  I am dividing the thread into a couple of parts.
>> This first one is about history issues of stoves in China.
>>
>> The Wikipedia article is informative.  But not about stoves.  Are there
>> writings about the "public kitchen" you mention or about stove issues such
>> as the smoke causing retaliation by the autorities?   Our focus is about
>> stoves and fuels.    I find this topic interesting, but only as history.
>> China has moved on since those bleak years of 1959-61.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>>
>> Doc  /  Dr TLUD  /  Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
>>
>> Email:  psanders at ilstu.edu
>>
>> Skype:   paultlud    Phone: +1-309-452-7072 <(309)%20452-7072>
>>
>> Website:  www.drtlud.com
>>
>> On 11/30/2017 8:55 PM, lh cheng wrote:
>>
>> Dear Dr Anderson and Stovers,
>>
>>   >Please provide more information about this statement about 30 million
>> deaths.
>>
>> this is the link https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Chinese_Famine
>> about it. many details. it is called "Gong Chan Feng( wind of Communism)"
>> by my father and mother and their generation, called "public kitchen"
>> movement also, if any smoke arise in any home, government officials would
>> rush in and destroy the stove, pots or dishes, these kind of thing is
>> forbidden in home, and all confiscated.  in some villages, no one survived
>> everyone died, in silence. if there were some smokeless clear-burn stove
>> applied, maybe more people could survive? actually, technology doesn't
>> matter at all, in a world of lies, technology only serves and helps lies.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Stoves mailing list
>>
>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
>>
>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_list
>> s.bioenergylists.org
>>
>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves,  News and Information see our web site:
>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Stoves mailing list
>>
>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
>>
>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_list
>> s.bioenergylists.org
>>
>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves,  News and Information see our web site:
>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
>>
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Stoves mailing list
>
> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
>
> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_
> lists.bioenergylists.org
>
> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves,  News and Information see our web site:
> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
>
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20171202/d15208b4/attachment.html>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: pottery stove 2.jpg
Type: image/jpeg
Size: 106100 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20171202/d15208b4/attachment.jpg>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: Pottery Stoves.jpg
Type: image/jpeg
Size: 85787 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20171202/d15208b4/attachment-0001.jpg>


More information about the Stoves mailing list