[Stoves] matrix3

[Ronal W. Larson]

Philip and list

	Thanks for the response - so far the only one.  Nikhil responded in this thread but I see no mention at all of the matrix.  I won’t respond to his message except to say I am disappointed in his last line unsupported slam again against GACC.

	See inserts below.



> On Dec 22, 2017, at 2:06 AM, Philip Lloyd <plloyd at mweb.co.za> wrote:
> 
> It made it through my system.  A few things were missing - like user acceptance.
	[RWL1:   Also the cost of stoves, and probably several other similar topics.  These do need to be mentioned in any report about stoves, but I don’t see a way to include them in the SDG context.
	What are the other things you found missing?
	

> A few things were included, which were so obviously marketing that I question their value.
	[RWL2:  What were those?

>  All those +++ against charcoal.  
	[RWL3:   Not understood.  I had mostly negatives, not positives against charcoal-using stoves.   
		My positives were all favoring a stove type - not “against”.
		Can you rephrase this?
		
> I have nothing against charcoal, but all the biomass users with whom I interact want to use all the energy in the wood they laboriously harvest, not use only half and then have to store the black stuff that remains.
	[RWL4:  A few weeks ago, Julien Winter shared a message with us where his char-making TLUD did both - used less wood than the competition and produced char.  The idea behind biochar is to put it in the ground - not to “store” it.   TLUDs use all, not half of the incoming biomass;  if the char is not placed in the soil, it can be used (I hope not) in a char-using stoves - saving the horrible waste in traditional (in-the bush) char making.  There 7/8 or 8/9 of a tree is wasted.

> Preaching biochar or charcoal cooking to them has not worked.
	[RWL:  “Preaching” isn’t probably the right word for Julien’s work, where a char-making stove seems to have had good success.  (Julien mentioned a marriage on the positive side and theft of a bag of char on the negative).
	 I’m not sure what you are referring to re “charcoal cooking” not working.  My experience with the topic is with heading a USAID project in Sudan, where I feel char use has pretty much ruined the country. The country runs on charcoal.   A formerly wooded country is now barren.

	I hope you and others will continue communicating on the value if any in this matrix to help improve what I consider a sad situation in the continued use of existing stoves - from especially the health, environment and societal (drudgery, gender inequity, etc) aspects featured in the SDG goals.

Ron
	
> 
> Prof Philip Lloyd
> Energy Institute, CPUT
> PO Box 1906
> Bellville 7535
> Tel 021 959 4323
> Cell 083 441 5247
> PA Nadia 021 959 4330
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org] On Behalf Of Ronal W. Larson
> Sent: Friday, December 22, 2017 2:07 AM
> To: Discussion of biomass
> Subject: [Stoves] matrix3
> 
> List:
> 
> 	I am attaching a 3-page pdf file that is a first attempt to compare different  stove types on a societal scale.  The words “WBT” and “fuel type” are not there.
> Please let me know if this didn’t make it through your system;  I can send this in other than pdf form.
> 
> Ron
> 
> 
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