[Stoves] Declaration about Woodgas
Paul Anderson
psanders at ilstu.edu
Sun Oct 22 13:02:44 CDT 2017
Dear Anil and A.D.,
Yes, I refer to the SMALL gasifiers (micro-gasifiers) that make
woodgas. There are many gases and variations of gases that can come
from wood and other biomass. The key is in the close-coupled
combustion (centimeters and seconds of time), meaning combustion INSIDE
the device where the pyrolytica woodgas is produced.
I am in Delhi now. Pre-Forum tomorrow (Monday).
Paul
Doc / Dr TLUD / Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
Email: psanders at ilstu.edu
Skype: paultlud Phone: +1-309-452-7072
Website: www.drtlud.com
On 10/21/2017 5:51 AM, Anand Karve wrote:
> Dear Paul,
> I assume that you meant to use the TLUD technology when you mentioned
> using wood gas as cooking fuel. If you are thinking of producing the
> wood gas in one place and burning it in a stove kept some distance
> away, I must agree with Anil that it would be dangerous to use it in a
> closely confined and ill ventilated place.
> Yours
> A.D.Karve
>
>
> ***
> Dr. A.D. Karve
>
> Chairman, Samuchit Enviro Tech Pvt Ltd (www.samuchit.com
> <http://www.samuchit.com>)
>
> Trustee & Founder President, Appropriate Rural Technology Institute (ARTI)
>
> On Sat, Oct 21, 2017 at 7:58 AM, nari phaltan <nariphaltan at gmail.com
> <mailto:nariphaltan at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Paul. We used producer gas for cooking in late 90s quite a lot for
> producing syrup from sweet sorghum. The details are at;
> www.nariphaltan.org/sorghum.pdf
> <http://www.nariphaltan.org/sorghum.pdf> together with photos.
>
> Wood gas (producer gas) is a clean fuel but dangerous since it is
> a mixture of CO and H2. If not used with proper ventilation it can
> be lethal. In closed house environments it is not advisable to use it.
>
> Anil
>
>
> Nimbkar Agricultural Research Institute (NARI)
> Tambmal, Phaltan-Lonand Road
> P.O.Box 44
> Phaltan-415523, Maharashtra, India
> Ph:+91-9168937964
> e-mail:nariphaltan at gmail.com <mailto:e-mail%3Anariphaltan at gmail.com>
> nariphaltan at nariphaltan.org <mailto:nariphaltan at nariphaltan.org>
>
> http://www.nariphaltan.org
>
> http://nariphaltan.org/about-2/awards/
> <http://nariphaltan.org/about-2/awards/> Awards for NARI staff
> http://nariphaltan.org/nari-in-press/
> <http://nariphaltan.org/nari-in-press/> NARI in press
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 20, 2017 at 9:36 PM, Paul Anderson <psanders at ilstu.edu
> <mailto:psanders at ilstu.edu>> wrote:
>
> Crispin,
> Thanks for the good comments.
>
> Many details will be eventually ironed out. Much will depend
> on the response from the many many participants. You wrote:
>
> This is Big Gas against Big Oil. Perhaps you need to
> create Big Wood and straighten both of them out.
>
> Is there really much clash between Big Gas and Big Oil? Wood
> is already BIG, but not big in the organized way and it is
> being burned poorly. Maybe it should become Big Biomass (more
> encompassing) IN RELATION TO HOUSEHOLD ENERGY. The pellet-fuel
> companies would be part.
>
> The strength (and weakness) of Big Biomass (as fuel) is that
> it is so dispersed and is found almost everywhere.
>
> Paul
>
> Doc / Dr TLUD / Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
> Email: psanders at ilstu.edu <mailto:psanders at ilstu.edu>
> Skype: paultlud Phone: +1-309-452-7072
> <tel:%2B1-309-452-7072>
> Website: www.drtlud.com <http://www.drtlud.com>
>
> On 10/20/2017 9:51 AM, Crispin Pemberton-Pigott wrote:
>
> Dear Paul
>
> I appreciate that you are on the right track.
>
> I know it is not absolute in the same manner, but could
> you say, "Woodgas can be a clean fuel too"?
>
> I am concerned that you correct say in the beginning that
> no fuel is clean on its own, an opinion shared widely,
> because it depends on how you burn it.
>
> Then it says further down that woodgas is a clean fuel,
> without the qualification contained in the earlier statement.
>
> Would you be better off saying something that undermines
> the incorrect notion that 'there are clean fuels and dirty
> fuels' and reinforces what is true: that ways and means
> exist to burn fuels cleanly and they should be used.
>
> I am not all that happy with "Woodgas can be a clean fuel
> too" because without context it is basically bandwagonning
> behind a dead horse. Like the WBT low power metrics, it
> has to be dragged off to the glue factory.
>
> No fuel is inherently clean by all definitions. Not even
> woodgas. How far can you take on the problem of the
> misrepresentation of scientific truth, while still
> pointing out that woodgas can be created and burned very
> cleanly, by any definition?
>
> I guarantee that those intending to profit from the
> misrepresentation will not help you. This is Big Gas
> against Big Oil. Perhaps you need to create Big Wood and
> straighten both of them out.
>
> Regards
> Crispin
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stoves
> [mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org
> <mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org>] On
> Behalf Of Paul Anderson
> Sent: 19-Oct-17 22:16
> To: Doc Anderson <psanders at ilstu.edu
> <mailto:psanders at ilstu.edu>>
> Subject: [Stoves] Declaration about Woodgas
>
> Stovers, Charists, and all,
>
> I have prepared a "Declaration of Clean Cooking with
> Woodgas" for everyone's consideration. A copy of the
> version as of today's date
> 2017-10-19 is attached, or you can get it at
> https://woodgas.com/declaration/
> <https://woodgas.com/declaration/> where any revisions
> will be available. Therefore, there is still time for your
> comments to be considered. This is now available several
> days before the start of the
> 2017 GACC Forum in Delhi, which I will be attending and
> will hear some feedback about this "Woodgas Declaration."
>
> The bulk of the page has the justification statements:
> "Whereas ......." (10 of them.) And based on the truth of
> those statements, then comes the declarations:
>
> "now, therefore be it
> DECLARED ...... that:
> 1. there are no "clean fuels" per se, but they can be
> “clean” (by definitions that are subject to discussion)
> only when properly combusted in appropriate, specialized
> combustion devices (burners and stoves), and fuels by
> themselves are neither clean nor dirty;
>
> 2. woodgas is a clean fuel when appropriate
> micro-gasifiers with designated solid fuels are used by
> adequately-experienced cookstove users;
>
> 3. woodgas has the potential to reach hundreds of millions
> of households to provide cleaner cooking while using
> smaller quantities of their current, locally-available
> fuel supplies, and all with sustainable financing, reduced
> expenditures, and even potential net profit;
>
> 4. leaders, authorities and all parties interested in
> clean cookstoves should recognize in words, writings,
> actions and financial support that solid biomass can
> become a very clean-burning fuel for cooking in woodgas
> stoves for millions of households; and
>
> 5. the expression “Woodgas is a Clean Fuel” is more than a
> motto, and it should be a guiding principle for prompt
> actions to assist at least one billion of the most
> underserved people on Earth, this being a most worthy goal
> that also has realistic prospects for being accomplished
> with honorable expedience. "
>
> Please participate in the discussions. I start my trip
> to India early on Saturday, so please discuss without
> expecting me to make replies promptly.
>
> Paul
>
> --
> Doc / Dr TLUD / Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
> Email: psanders at ilstu.edu <mailto:psanders at ilstu.edu>
> Skype: paultlud Phone: +1-309-452-7072
> <tel:%2B1-309-452-7072>
> Website: www.drtlud.com <http://www.drtlud.com>
>
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