[Stoves] More about concentrators.

Sat Mar 30 13:20:40 CDT 2019

Julien;

Your design sounds interesting withy the nozzle. Sounds like we need
another TLUD Summit sometime this summer - HINT, HINT  HINT!!!!

Amen on your comments about our dime!

Norm

On Sat, Mar 30, 2019 at 8:13 AM Julien Winter <winter.julien at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hi Norm;
>
> I have not heard of any emissions testing on Dave Yarrow's nozzle TLUD
> combustor.
>
> On a cookstove ND-TLUD, I will do some tuning to an internal riser ±
> nozzle, then send that for testing.
>
> Remember, we have to measure CH4 as well, else TLUDs will be left out of
> carbon credits schemes.
>
> Pity that we have to do all of this on our own dime.  If we had a research
> grant, we would have all problems solved.
>
> Julien.
>
> On Fri, Mar 29, 2019 at 9:10 AM Julien Winter <winter.julien at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi Norm;
>>
>> The photograph is of a double-walled TLUD with pre-heated secondary air.
>> The 55 gal. drum has no bottom.   The 35 gal drum is the TLUD reactor.
>>
>> However, I have put the same burner on at single-walled 55 gal. TLUD,
>> with a gap between the top of the drum and the lid supporting the burner.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Julien.
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 28, 2019 at 10:22 PM Norman Baker <ntbakerphd at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Julien;
>>>
>>> Thank you so much. Now that I see the nozzle, I remember it well. Seems
>>> like a good idea to promote mixing.
>>>
>>> The 55 gal. barrel has holes in the bottom like a TLUD? And, I assume
>>> the 35 gal. is a retort?
>>>
>>> By the way, David Yarrow now lives just south of Olympia Washington
>>> where he is very active in a soils group called Nutriculture. Very
>>> interesting man.
>>>
>>> Norm
>>>
>>> On Thu, Mar 28, 2019 at 4:41 PM Julien Winter <winter.julien at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Norm;
>>>>
>>>> The nozzle discussed above would replace a concentrator ring in a
>>>> ND-TLUD cookstove, or go at the bottom of an internal riser burner.
>>>>
>>>> For a 55 gallon TLUD, a nozzle can be adapted from black stove pipe
>>>> expanding/reducing connectors.  There is a picture of one (attached) that I
>>>> built in 2013, following the advice of David Yarrow.  It is a 35 gallon
>>>> drum inside of a 55 gallon drum.  David suggested cutting diagonal slits in
>>>> the side of the expanding connector to create a tertiary air entry point.
>>>> Later, I attached three cable guy-wires, with turn-buckles, to stabilize
>>>> the stack.   I don't have it any more.  I gave it away to a friend.
>>>>
>>>> For these nozzles, I assume that there is a large degree of mixing of
>>>> secondary air and pyrolytic gases before they enter the nozzle.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Julien.
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Mar 28, 2019 at 12:53 PM Norman Baker <ntbakerphd at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Julien;
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm not sure I entirely understand where you put the nozzle? Where
>>>>> would you suggest in my 55 gal. TLUD?
>>>>>
>>>>> Norm
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Mar 28, 2019 at 6:58 AM Anderson, Paul <psanders at ilstu.edu>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Julien,    (and to the Stoves Listserv, and for posting at my
>>>>>> website  www.drtlud.com/eposts   )
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Interesting.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Are the nozzles with slanted walls (like in a funnel) or with
>>>>>> straight sides?    What diameters at each end for what sized of TLUD
>>>>>> gasifiers?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Paul
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Doc / Dr TLUD / Paul S. Anderson, PhD
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Exec. Dir. of Juntos Energy Solutions NFP
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Email:  psanders at ilstu.edu       Skype:   paultlud
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Phone:  Office: 309-452-7072    Mobile: 309-531-4434
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Website:   www.drtlud.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *From:* Julien Winter <winter.julien at gmail.com>
>>>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, March 28, 2019 8:31 AM
>>>>>> *To:* Norman Baker <ntbakerphd at gmail.com>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Norm;
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Instead of a concentrator ring, try a nozzle.    A nozzle brings the
>>>>>> burning gases together without the shape edges of a concentrator ring.
>>>>>>  The sharp edges could generate soot.  A nozzle has smooth edges.   TLUD
>>>>>> nozzles are being manufactured, but they are being misused!!   People are
>>>>>> turning them upside down and using them to load mason jars with food.   So,
>>>>>> you can find TLUD nozzels on the shelves for food canning supplies in
>>>>>> hardware stores.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The reason why I got into the stove burner design business about five
>>>>>> years ago was because when I used concentrator rings, I got deposits on the
>>>>>> bottom of pots.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Julien.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Mar 28, 2019 at 1:47 AM Norman Baker <ntbakerphd at gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Paul;
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I assume you mean the diameter of the stack or combustor? In
>>>>>> prior tests with concentrator rings, a whole that has a diameter of 70% of
>>>>>> the stack seem to be adequate. Lately, I have been going to about an 80%
>>>>>> diameter.  In one publication I read the stack diameter should be at least
>>>>>> 60% of the feedstock barrel diameter. Otherwise the time needed for gases
>>>>>> to exit the combustor became too fast and hence too short for complete
>>>>>> combustion. Is this your experience? And how about the rest of you chiming
>>>>>> in on this.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Norm
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 27, 2019 at 8:05 PM Anderson, Paul <psanders at ilstu.edu>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Norm,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In general, the diameter of the hole is about half of the diameter.
>>>>>> But there might not be any visible (noticeable) impact if reduced or
>>>>>> enlarge 10 to 20% of the size of the  hole.  Trial and error are your best
>>>>>> bets to get this refined.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I look forward to hearing of your results.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Paul
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Julien Winter
>>>> Cobourg, ON, CANADA
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Julien Winter
>> Cobourg, ON, CANADA
>>
>
>
> --
> Julien Winter
> Cobourg, ON, CANADA
>
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