[Stoves] Tier 4 Biochar Stoves

[ajheggie at gmail.com]

Christa

We have a saying in UK that one can stand waiting for many hours for a bus
to arrive and then several arrive at once, this is the case here after a
dearth of posts we have this thread and two good posts about perceived
value from Paul Arveson and David Meed.

I must have misunderstood how tiers work, probably mainly because I am
sceptical of their value, so please indulge me.

I thought tiers were like ranks in an army, tier 1 is the basic soldier
able to shoot a gun, tier 2 is a section leader, able to shoot a gun a bit
better  and organise a few men, tier 3 is a subaltern, able to shoot a gun
well,  organise more men and produce and direct a tactic tier 4 uns so
weiter.

The point being there is a succession  each tier being built on the
previous  and each element bettering the attributes in lower tiers.

Have I got that wrong?

Andrew

On Wed, 15 Jan 2020 at 09:24, Christa Roth (bioenergylist) <
stoves at foodandfuel.info> wrote:

> Crispin,
>
> Three points to your mail:
>
>
>    1. I don’t agree with you that the Mimi Moto is the same product as
>    the Philipps stove. I think you mix that up with the ACE stove produced by
>    African Clean Energy in Lesotho who used to produce  the Philipps stove.
>    Mimi Moto is a completely different product  among other things addressing
>    many of the glitches users observed with the Philipps. Please check it out
>    https://mimimoto.nl/
>    2. I totally agree with you on the need to specify ‚which category of
>    performance Tier‘ is meant. If I didn’t miss anything, there is no
>    agreement on a single tier rating of stoves??? To my understanding there is
>    no overall agreed upon tier rating for stoves, so there is no ‚Tier 4
>    stove‘, there could only be ‚Tier 4 4 4 4 etc.’ stoves depending on the
>    performance categories. We should remind ourselves not to fall into the
>    trap and reiterate the wrong jargon. Otherwise we should not be surprised
>    to get ‚Worldbank‘ and the likes asking for things that don#t exist or are
>    not agreed upon like the absurdities of ‚single tier stoves‘. We already
>    predicted back in 2012 during IWA that things might got oversimplified and
>    they did! No idea how to stop that other than repeating the same message
>    over and over again to be specific on individual ratings of performance
>    categories of stoves.
>    3. To my experience the rating of TLUDs/biochar making stoves is even
>    more dependent on the fuel quality (type of material, moisture, particle
>    size and particle size distribution, etc.) and the user behaviour than a
>    wood or charcoal stove. Unless you use standardised pellets (adhering to
>    some of the pellet norms) instead of found fuels you get a different
>    performance every time you run a stove as the fuel is so unpredictable,
>    thus the unpredictable performance.  I am not aware that we have proof that
>    a lab test predicts the field performance of gasifier stoves. Maybe
>    something to discuss at ETHOS 2020?
>
>
>
>
>
> Best regards
> Christa
>
>
>
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