[Greenbuilding] fireproof light deck

Fri Apr 8 09:32:16 CDT 2011

I found some rock wool board that could be covered with a thin layer
of colored concrete.
Lots of high embodied energy...but would last.

http://www.o-digital.com/wholesale-products/2179/2198-1/High-Density-Rock-Wool-BoardPanel-91893.html

Gennaro Brooks-Church

Cell: 1 347 244 3016 USA
www.EcoBrooklyn.com
22 2nd St; Brooklyn, NY 11231

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 10:20 AM, JOHN SALMEN <terrain at shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> From: greenbuilding-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org
> [mailto:greenbuilding-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org] On Behalf Of Gennaro
> Brooks-Church
> Sent: April 7, 2011 12:41 PM
> To: Green Building
>
> Subject: Re: [Greenbuilding] fireproof light deck
>
>
>
> Hard to know what you are also wanting to achieve here. I did a roof deck in
> ny for gardens and we reinforced to the roof to take the additional load.
>
> I imagine the roof is a basically flat tarry mess that has been patched and
> repatched over the years. Is it time to completely reroof? You would
> probably gain a lot of new capacity removing a few extra pounds of old
> roofing.
>
> Does the ‘decking’ need to span or be elevated over the old roof. You can
> get cem-board panels (2x4,4x4,4x8) designed for recover of old roofs that
> would provide a flat walking surface at about 2lbs per foot. This is 3/8”
> thickness but could be put on rpl sleepers or even thinset mortared to
> rockwool boards (which could provide for some drainage and insulation at
> less weight). They could be painted stained or even stuccoed. Perlite
> recover boards are even lighter (aobut 1lb but need more surface protection
> from elements. These materials are typically fire and wind rated for
> approvals everywhere for a roof application.
>
> If you want to take a cottage craft approach you could cut rockwool board
> into patio stone shapes and stucco skin them with a little steel or
> fibreglass mesh (think concrete canoe). Similar to foam rocks these can be
> surprisingly strong.
>
>
>
>
>
> I suspect that this issue is being pondered by every deck team in NYC
> - What decking will satisfy code, weight requirements and aesthetics.
> RPL may do code and weight but definitely not everyone likes the look
> of it. Aerated concrete pavers?
> Gennaro Brooks-Church
>
> Cell: 1 347 244 3016 USA
> www.EcoBrooklyn.com
> 22 2nd St; Brooklyn, NY 11231
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 1:58 PM, Tim Vireo Keating
> <t.keating at rainforestrelief.org> wrote:
>> The issue in NYC is not combustability but flame-spread. That's the test
>> that yields the typical Class A rating, as far as I am aware. Ipe was
>> assumed to be Class A because importers said it was. I spoke with the main
>> researcher at the US Forest Service Forest Products Lab who challenged
>> this,
>> given that no one had ever been able to produce the actual studies that
>> were
>> being quoted by importers/resellers. He told others calling him for
>> verification to do their owns testing. Finally, someone did and the
>> results
>> yielded a Class B rating. Thus, all those roofs decked with ipê beyond 20%
>> will likely go up just as readily as good oak. And the other issue when
>> doing this testing is that, of course, ipê, like all woods, will lose
>> mechanical properties over time. The more porous the wood gets as it ages,
>> the more likely it is to support the spreading of a fire. For some reason,
>> I
>> don't think this factor has ever been considered (unless people have been
>> told that that (spurious) Class A rating will only last for 10 years and
>> then the building owner must replace the material with new ipê.
>> IMHO, the only answer to this of which I know would be RPL.
>> tim keating
>> At 10:21 AM -0400 4/4/11, John Straube wrote:
>>
>> There seems to be some confusion.
>>
>> Non-combustible in the code does not mean "it does not burn".  It means it
>> passes a silly ASTM test, and does not lose more than x % of weight (I
>> think
>> x=10%).
>>
>> All wood I have seen fails this, even fire retardent wood, because it off
>> gases enough water and oils that it fails.
>>
>> Gypsum looses too much mass, and would fail, except that it is
>> grandfathered.
>>
>> Fiberglass does not work. Concrete and steel do.
>>
>> So Gennaro, do you mean non combustible or do you mean fire rated or
>> something else?
>>
>> On 2011-04-04, at 9:47 AM, Ron Cascio wrote:
>>
>> Check this material out;
>>
>>
>>
>> http://www.timbersilwood.com/
>>
>>
>>
>> Can't wait to try some of it out sometime soon.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Ron
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>
>> From: David Bergman
>>
>> To: Green Building ; Gennaro Brooks-Church
>>
>> Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 12:13 AM
>>
>> Subject: Re: [Greenbuilding] fireproof light deck
>>
>> Gennaro,
>>
>> Add "eco material" to that description and it becomes an old quest of
>> mine.
>> Are you talking about something to sit directly on the "real" roof? About
>> the best I could come up with when I last tackled the question was
>> lightweight concrete roof pavers -- not all that eco though maybe there
>> are
>> some made with flyash.
>>
>> In terms of wood, NYC used to accept Ipe, but I heard a rumor they stopped
>> when the fire rating claims didn't prove out. And, of course, there was
>> the
>> rainforest sourcing issue.
>>
>> I've looked for fire-rated recycled plastic lumber from time to time, but
>> have not yet found any. (Tim V-K: any updates you've heard of?)
>>
>> There is a group called Brooklyn Bridge Forest
>> ( http://www.brooklynbridgeforest.com/) that is trying to set up a
>> sustainable source for greenheart for maintaining the Brooklyn Bridge. I'm
>> not sure what kind of fire rating greenheart does or doesn't have.
>> (According to one site I just googled, it carries a "high/medium" rating.)
>>
>> David
>> David Bergman  RA   LEED AP
>> DAVID BERGMAN ARCHITECT / FIRE & WATER LIGHTING + FURNITURE
>> architecture . interiors . ecodesign . lighting . furniture
>> bergman at cyberg.com    www.cyberg.com
>> 241 Eldridge Street #3R, New York, NY 10002
>> t 212 475 3106    f 212 677 7291
>> At 08:01 PM 4/3/2011, Gennaro Brooks-Church wrote:
>>
>> Hello,
>> Can anyone suggest a lightweight non-combustible deck material for a roof
>> deck?
>> In New York a brownstone has an average flat roof of 700sq.ft. The law
>> only
>> allows 20% of it to be covered with combustible decking, which isn't much
>> of
>> a deck. Yet the non-combustible decking is too heavy for the old roofs.
>> Suggestion?
>>
>> Gennaro Brooks-Church
>>
>> Cell: 1 347 244 3016 USA
>>
>> www.EcoBrooklyn.com
>> 22 2nd St; Brooklyn, NY 11231
>>
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>> Dr John Straube, P.Eng.
>>
>> Associate Professor
>>
>> University of Waterloo
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>>
>> www.buildingscience.com
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