[Stoves] "stove-acceptance" of char-making [TLUD] stoves.

Paul Anderson psanders at ilstu.edu
Mon Dec 3 13:19:47 CST 2012


Dear Leslie and all Stovers, especially those with interest in 
char-making stoves,

(also being sent one time to the Biochar Listserv (yahoogroups) for 
their comments also.)

Leslie raises a valid question:

Should the various issues about "making of char in cookstoves" be a 
topic at the GACC Forum?

For THAT I can fully agree with.   One or two presentations, or maybe an 
open session.   That aspect of the session/presentation would be a 
natural fit with discussions of TLUD gasifiers and any other devices 
that can intentionally produce char.

And when that char will be burned in improved charcoal stoves, it 
becomes doubly interesting for the stoves conference.

Mention can certainly be made that the produced char could also be used 
as "biochar"  (char destined  put into soils).

Here I raise the questions:
Which of the biochar (BIOchar) aspects can or should be presented at the 
Stoves Forum?

To what extent should they be emphasized?

And who will be in attendance at the Forum for such discussions?

__I__ intend to be at the Forum and will be speaking (if selected to be 
a presenter) about TLUD stoves that "make charcoal that can be burned or 
used as biochar".   My current thinking is that I will request to 
present about the latest developments of the TChar variation of TLUD 
stoves, and in those stoves the charcoal is consumed by burning.   I 
will mention the biochar prospects and can answer questions that could 
arise about biochar, but there will not be more than a minute of two for 
BIOchar comments.

Please speak up about "biochar as a topic at a stove Forum".   And do 
say if you plan to be there in mid March.

Paul

Paul S. Anderson, PhD  aka "Dr TLUD"
Email:  psanders at ilstu.edu   Skype: paultlud  Phone: +1-309-452-7072
Website:  www.drtlud.com

On 12/3/2012 11:33 AM, Leslie Cordes wrote:
>
> Colleagues -- the abstract submission process is currently open for 
> the Alliance Clean Cooking Forum in Cambodia.  We have not finalized 
> the agenda by any means so please feel free to submit an application 
> on that the biochar subject where it will be considered with the other 
> submissions. We will also have open sessions each morning from 7-9 am 
> for groups to meet on whatever subject they choose as well as many 
> informal opportunities to share information on topics like biochar and 
> so I invite you to join us.
>
> Regards,
>
> Leslie
>
> p.s. the travel scholarship application process is also open right 
> now. Please note you must be a member of the Alliance to apply.
>
> *From:*Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org] *On 
> Behalf Of *Paul Anderson
> *Sent:* Monday, December 03, 2012 9:07 AM
> *To:* Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> *Cc:* biochar at yahoogroups.com; Emmanuel Bukenya; Hugh McLaughlin; Bob 
> Fairchild
> *Subject:* Re: [Stoves] "stove-acceptance" of char-making [TLUD] stoves.
>
> Stephen,
>
> Excellent.    Please note:   There is a major GACC stove meeting in 
> Cambodia in March 2013.   Not much there about biochar, so it is 
> unlikely that you will attend.   But I will be there and I (and 
> others) would like to have your data / results about acceptance of 
> "stoves that make biochar" (probably aka TLUDs ).   Please make every 
> effort to make the results available in time.
>
> If you need a person for discussions without using list serves (such 
> as for commenting on drafts on a confidential basis), I volunteer or 
> could help you find others.
>
> Paul
>
> Paul S. Anderson, PhD  aka "Dr TLUD"
> Email:psanders at ilstu.edu  <mailto:psanders at ilstu.edu>    Skype: paultlud  Phone: +1-309-452-7072
> Website:www.drtlud.com  <http://www.drtlud.com>
>
> On 12/3/2012 4:45 AM, Stephen Joseph wrote:
>
>     Hi Guys
>
>     Very positive acceptance of the PED biochar stove in Northern
>     Vietnam.  Initial results to be published next year and a short
>     article soon when I manage to get time to write it.
>
>     Regards
>
>     Stephen Joseph
>
>     On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 6:07 PM, Paul Anderson <psanders at ilstu.edu
>     <mailto:psanders at ilstu.edu>> wrote:
>
>     Dear Stovers,
>
>     On 11/30/2012 2:06 PM, rongretlarson at comcast.net
>     <mailto:rongretlarson at comcast.net> wrote:
>
>         *[RWL4b':  <snip>         I just finished reading the thesis
>         by  Robert Pendleton Taylor recommended by Jim Jetter
>         yesterday.  He has 6-7 different ways to subdivide the stoves
>         universe and none are by char character.. **
>         *However, the issue of how to handle char permeates that
>         thesis - and I think appropriately.  The char issue raised by
>         Dr.   Taylor revolves around "batch" stoves - which is a
>         pretty close match to your "climate change" stoves.  I need to
>         emphasize that primary emphasis has to be on the
>         "cooking/heating" (not on the char) - or no one will use a
>         char-making stove.   I think char-making stoves win the
>         stove-acceptance battle hands-down - but there is almost no
>         data to prove that.**
>
>     I agree with Ron on several points:
>     1.   Almost no data.
>     2.  TLUD stoves have acceptance by users.
>     3.  That Ron and I are biased [but correct!!] in our favorable
>     opinions about char-making stoves.   But we also have some of the
>     longest times working with them.   Ron started in the 1990s and me
>     in 2001, both with Tom Reed.
>
>     The lack of data on stove acceptance of TLUD stoves is largely
>     because of so little offer of them to users. And almost never have
>     they been offered side by side with other types of stoves.
>
>     Four exceptions:
>     A.  The Oorja TLUD-FA (fan assisted) did 400,000 units in India
>     with BP funding.   And that stove (with some style updates, etc)
>     is still on the market by First Energy.   Clearly somebody liked
>     it enough to use it.   However, the Oorja is not designed to make
>     char.  So set that case aside.
>     B.  Philips is getting into the gasifier stove scene.   Unlikely
>     that they are doing it without some data on acceptance by users.  
>     But no data from them.
>     C.  Some models of World Stoves by Nat Mulcahy make char, but
>     again data on acceptance is not released.
>
>     [All three cases above are by for-profit businesses.]
>
>     D.  The recently complete (Sept 2012, with Final Report still in
>     Draft form) Mwoto TLUD-ND (natural draft) by the World Bank BEIA
>     project in Uganda found that acceptance of that TLUD exceeded the
>     ability of the tinsmiths to produce units.   That shows some very
>     favorable acceptance.   As a result of that project, at least
>     three private companies have been created (Mwoto Factories, Awamu
>     Biomass Energy, and Pamoja - Uganda) and some independent
>     tinsmiths are continuing to make TLUD-ND gasifier stoves in
>     Uganda.   These are start-up operations with minimal funding, but
>     they are progressing and certainly have a positive attitude about
>     user acceptance.
>
>     In summary, Ron's statement of his belief that  :
>
>     *char-making stoves win the stove-acceptance battle hands-down *
>
>     remains to be proven or dis-proven.
>
>     Paul
>
>     Paul S. Anderson, PhD  aka "Dr TLUD"
>
>     Email:psanders at ilstu.edu  <mailto:psanders at ilstu.edu>    Skype: paultlud  Phone:+1-309-452-7072  <tel:%2B1-309-452-7072>
>
>     Website:www.drtlud.com  <http://www.drtlud.com>
>
>
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