[Stoves] [biochar-policy] Re: Stoves

Tue Jun 26 02:05:34 CDT 2012

Dear Jock,
not everybody has the time and dexterity to construct his/her own cleanly
burning stove. I agree that the improved stoves should be made locally,
but the job must be done by somebody who knows how to do the job
properly. Therefore, even at the local level, the stove would be fabricated
in a workshop that has the necessary tools and skilled personnel to operate
them.  Stove fabrication thus becomes an enterprise, which then sells the
stoves.
Yours
A.D.Karve
On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 5:23 AM, <rongretlarson at comcast.net> wrote:

>   Clement  (cc Jock and 2 lists):
>
>      I agree with Jock.  But we need more information about you and your
> goals.
>
>      The "stoves list is much better for this purpose than
> "biochar-policy".   Many on this list(and 3 other Biochar lists) are also
> on "stoves"  - which is a sister list - all started by Tom MIles.  About
> half the dialog there will be on char-making stoves.  To get to the
> excellent stove archives, go to
>     http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/ and
>     http://info.bioenergylists.org/
>
> Unfortunately, just right now they are down for new software.
>
>  See inserts below.
>
> ------------------------------
> *From: *"Jock" <jg45 at mac.com>
> *To: *biochar-policy at yahoogroups.com
> *Sent: *Monday, June 25, 2012 8:35:51 AM
> *Subject: *[biochar-policy] Re: Stoves
>
>
>
> All,
>
> If I remember correctly, the parable of the fish recommends that people be
> taught how to fish, not that they be given fish.  No where is it suggested
> that they be sold a fish.
>
> I suggest the same applies to stoves.  Let's teach people the basics and
> let them develop locally appropriate solutions for themselves.  I find the
> idea that stoves must only be sold, and that all stoves must include a
> profit rent, to be a true perversion.
>
> Regards,
>
> Jock
>
> Jock Gill
>
> --- In biochar-policy at yahoogroups.com, clement doyer <cdoyer at ...> wrote:
>
> *[RWL:   Inserts that Jock left out:*
>
> All this discussion is interesting to me but I find it hard to follow.
> I'm a farmer in Northern Thailand, and a researcher-practitioner in
> alternative methods of health maintenance for animals (
> www.labosolidago.com) and for plants.
>
>      [RWL:   You also (from the web site) seem to be partially in
> Quebec.  I have added Alex English in Ontario as being quite expert in
> Biochar, should you sometimes be back in Canada.   Your website is very
> interesting - and I would think a lot could be done with Biochar at your
> QAuebec facilities also.
>
>  I'm mostly interested in mounting a practical paper on how to make the
> "best" biochar stove, so that I will be able to present it to Cuba in the
> hope of helping them to get carbon credits for a national effort, this is
> my target.
>
>     [RWL:  After Tom Mile's "stoves" site is back up, I think wandering
> around there will give you several ideas.  Look especially for a recent GTZ
> paper by Christa Roth.
>
>      I think there may be several biochar folk in Haiti already,  but one
> for sure still going is Nat Mulcahy of World Stove  (address above)   I
> think Nat has achieved some voluntary credits, but not sure about Haiti.
>
> Can somebody on the list direct me towards people who have tried different
> types of stoves and have compared them?
>
>     [RWL:   Again -  Christa Roth.  See also list dialog from Dean Still
> of Aprovecho.  Jim Jetter at EPA.  But there is no "Consumer Reports" yet.
>
>      But returning to Jock's advice - building a few yourself may be best
> getting ready for Haiti (or northern Thailand).   One fairly simple design
> available on the web is by Nat at WorldStove.  Called the "Everything
> Nice".  One friend of mine is happy with it.   I personally am hoping to
> see more stoves with primary air control - and Paul Anderson has shown many
> different designs with that feature.  There are quite a few others with
> nice work.  There is no lack of ideas and photos;  not much comparative.
>
>
> > Why is it so hard to purchase stoves, even to get prices?
>
> *   RWL:    I assume you mean charcoal-making stoves only.   The reason
> is we're still new - about 16 years on the stove side and about 6 for
> Biochar.   Not enough people* have gotten the message on either.  You are
> ahead of most.
>
>
> > Finally, has anyone ever heard of the idea of making biochat with the
> left overs after palm oil extraction?
>
>     [RWL:  I have seen the idea mentioned at least a half-dozen times.  I
> know of no results to send you to - but the (down) stoves archives could
> well have something.   I can't think of any reason it shouldn't be ideal
> (being free or close to it).   I assume biochat is a typo?   I've tried
> "chat" once (no impact) and assume that palm oil residue won't satisfy
> those who take "chat" seriously - especially if pyrolyzed.]
>
>
> > Sorry for the change of subject!
>
>       [RWL:  No  -  your website, location(s), and goals are very
> interesting.  If you tell us a little more on scale, how this might fit in
> with dairying, and other background - we might be able to get more
> specific.  I wouldn't limit your thoughts only to Haiti.   Best of luck.
> Ron
>
>   > Clement Doyer
> >
>
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-- 
***
Dr. A.D. Karve
Trustee & Founder President, Appropriate Rural Technology Institute (ARTI)
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