[Stoves] Stoves Digest, Vol 33, Issue 19
Otto Formo
terra-matricula at hotmail.com
Fri May 17 10:32:35 CDT 2013
Dear Tom,
Thanks for your clear explenation of TOTAL gasfication, like forced draft (WoodGas) and Pyrolytic Gasfication in a natural draft (Peko Pe) gasfication device.
Forced draft is typically acived by a fan and can also be considred as a down draft "system" too, as you say?
It will consume the biomass "completely" - TOTAL gasfication.
Natural draft is an up draft "system", (of natural cources) and a Pyrolytic gasfication, and will leave us the char which again can be used as biochar or charcoal in any other charcoal device.
Your experiment, about the tar on the pot in a natural draft pyrolytic gasifier, means that the tar still remains in the charcoal or it is burned off?
What about the brown powdery substance on the towel (pot)?
Moisture content in biomass, insufficent combustion and tar is a "well known" challange in any heating device, apart from boilers, as I know of.
Does it means that even forced draft systems, will create tar in terms of beeing affected by a lower temperature in a chimney or cold water in a pot?
So, you consider charcoal from a natural draft pyrolytic gasifier to be more suitable as biochar vs commercial charcoal?
Enjoy your spring, planting season and most suitable biochar.............:)
Thanks
Otto
> CC: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> From: tombreed2010 at gmail.com
> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 20:54:30 -0700
> To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Stoves Digest, Vol 33, Issue 19
>
> Dear Gasologist
>
> We should all distinguish clearly when discussing gasification between
>
> O Total gasification (eg an Imbert gasifier) that converts typically 98% ot the wood to WoodGas
>
> O Pyrolytic Gasification (TLUD and larger) which primarily gasifies the cellulose and pyrolyses the lignin to ~20% charcoal
>
> <><><>
>
> The smoke from a TLUD stove will leave a deposit on a cold steel plate. I was interested in finding out how much "tar" was in the TLUD combustible gas before it is burned.
>
> I measured the "tar" production from a TLUD stove by putting a 4" galvanized elbow (wrapped in wetted towels) in the stove, and a 4 ft length of galvanized pipe followed by another elbow and chimney.
>
> Instead of the tarry deposit I expected, I obtained about 1% of a brown powdery deposit that was quite dry to the touch.
>
> I now wish I had saved it and analyzed it further. But I suspect a similar experiment on the Imbert gas would give a much higher "Tar" content, originating mostly from the lignin.
>
> <><><>
>
> The charcoal resulting from the TLUD is generally a bonus, depending whether you have a use for it. The temperature of the flaming pyrolysis below the surface of the TLUD stove is between 500 and 700 C (measured with a Cr-Al thermocouple). For this reason, the charcoal produced is much more absorptive than commercial (<450 C) charcoal.
>
> This spring I am doing some planting tests on TLUD charcoal vs commercial charcoal. I'll report results.
>
> Onward to the future of charcoal...
>
> Tom Reed
>
>
>
> Dr. Thomas B Reed
> Tombreed2010 at gmail.com
> 508-353-7841
>
>
>
> On May 14, 2013, at 11:00 AM, stoves-request at lists.bioenergylists.org wrote:
>
> > Send Stoves mailing list submissions to
> > stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >
> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > stoves-request at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >
> > You can reach the person managing the list at
> > stoves-owner at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >
> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > than "Re: Contents of Stoves digest..."
> >
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> > 1. Using all the energy when char making (Art Donnelly)
> > 2. Re: Using all the energy when char making (Francesco Tortorici)
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 09:50:30 -0600
> > From: Art Donnelly <art.donnelly at seachar.org>
> > To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> > Subject: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> > Message-ID:
> > <CALyHvqpKvNNZg8VoS2QmGq4R3UUSi6UKC1wNuxpuq2oe_deg-w at mail.gmail.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> >
> > Hi all,
> > Francesco, that's a nice looking setup. SeaChar has a couple of volunteers
> > (bi-lingual) in Costa Rica that want to do the same thing. Can we introduce
> > them to your friends and set-up an information exchange?
> > Also, I have attached a photo of our "in progress" TLUD heat exchanger. It
> > will be used to dry cacao beans.
> > Our goal is to make every BTU count.
> > Art Donnelly
> >
> >
> > On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 8:56 AM, <stoves-request at lists.bioenergylists.org>wrote:
> >
> >> Send Stoves mailing list submissions to
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> >>
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> >> stoves-request at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> You can reach the person managing the list at
> >> stoves-owner at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> >> than "Re: Contents of Stoves digest..."
> >>
> >>
> >> Today's Topics:
> >>
> >> 1. Re: Using all the energy when char making (Francesco Tortorici)
> >> 2. Re: Using all the energy when char making (Tom Miles)
> >> 3. Re: Using all the energy when char making (Nariphaltan)
> >> 4. Continuous gasifier for household scale - experience sharing
> >> (Tuong DoDuc)
> >> 5. Re: Using all the energy when char making
> >> (rongretlarson at comcast.net)
> >> 6. Re: Continuous gasifier for household scale - experience
> >> sharing (Paul Olivier)
> >> 7. Re: Continuous gasifier for household scale - experience
> >> sharing (Tuong DoDuc)
> >> 8. Re: Using all the energy when char making (Nariphaltan)
> >> 9. Re: Using all the energy when char making (Tom Miles)
> >>
> >>
> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 1
> >> Date: Mon, 13 May 2013 11:13:42 -0700
> >> From: Francesco Tortorici <francescot at gmail.com>
> >> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >> Message-ID:
> >> <CAKiNAwXcz9yYu3Gh4=dbb8=
> >> z-3QuWps6+yWtrCGmwu-A8oKZDQ at mail.gmail.com>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
> >>
> >> Here is an example of a local mushroom grower that uses a TLUD to
> >> pasteurize straw. Previously he used propane, but now uses his gasifier
> >> stove. The biochar produced is "charged" with worm castings and worm tea
> >> that is also a "byproduct' of his mushroom business.
> >>
> >> This is an example of of having a need for the heat and the willingness to
> >> try something different. His operation is small and located on the
> >> Olympic Peninsula of Washington State.
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 10:54 AM, Frank Shields <frank at compostlab.com
> >>> wrote:
> >>
> >>> *Stovers,*
> >>>
> >>> * *
> >>>
> >>> * *
> >>>
> >>> *Seems there is often a lot of wasted energy that could be used when
> >>> making char that is just flared off. *
> >>>
> >>> *I?m thinking the reason is that to convert to electricity one needs 1) a
> >>> very clean syngas 2) an expensive motor and 3) costly up-keep. The
> >>> generator is a onetime purchase with low maintenance.*
> >>>
> >>> * *
> >>>
> >>> *So why not use a steam engine to convert the flame to electricity?
> >>> Perhaps not as efficient but all you are doing is heating water so the
> >> gas
> >>> need not be as clean as when drawn into an internal combustion engine. *
> >>>
> >>> * *
> >>>
> >>> * *
> >>>
> >>> *Thanks*
> >>>
> >>> * *
> >>>
> >>> * *
> >>>
> >>> *Frank *
> >>>
> >>> * *
> >>>
> >>> * *
> >>>
> >>> Thanks ****
> >>>
> >>> ** **
> >>>
> >>> Frank Shields****
> >>>
> >>> ** **
> >>>
> >>> BioChar Division****
> >>>
> >>> Control Laboratories, Inc. ****
> >>>
> >>> 42 Hangar Way****
> >>>
> >>> Watsonville, CE 95076****
> >>>
> >>> ** **
> >>>
> >>> (831) 724-5422 tel****
> >>>
> >>> (81) 724-3188 fax****
> >>>
> >>> frank at biocharlab.com****
> >>>
> >>> www.controllabs.com****
> >>>
> >>> * *
> >>>
> >>> * *
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>
> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >> URL: <
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/581f8a8a/attachment-0001.html
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> >> Name: 0. 6-29-12 Fan.jpg
> >> Type: image/jpeg
> >> Size: 117950 bytes
> >> Desc: not available
> >> URL: <
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/581f8a8a/attachment-0005.jpg
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> >> Name: 2. 7-18-12 Max Burn.jpg
> >> Type: image/jpeg
> >> Size: 90033 bytes
> >> Desc: not available
> >> URL: <
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/581f8a8a/attachment-0006.jpg
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> >> Name: 3. 6-29-12 Straw.jpg
> >> Type: image/jpeg
> >> Size: 78759 bytes
> >> Desc: not available
> >> URL: <
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/581f8a8a/attachment-0007.jpg
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> >> Name: 4. 7-18-12 Post Burn.jpg
> >> Type: image/jpeg
> >> Size: 111959 bytes
> >> Desc: not available
> >> URL: <
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/581f8a8a/attachment-0008.jpg
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> >> Name: 5. 7-18-12 BioChar.jpg
> >> Type: image/jpeg
> >> Size: 128846 bytes
> >> Desc: not available
> >> URL: <
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/581f8a8a/attachment-0009.jpg
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 2
> >> Date: Mon, 13 May 2013 11:20:14 -0700
> >> From: "Tom Miles" <tmiles at trmiles.com>
> >> To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'"
> >> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >> Message-ID: <013901ce5006$84200580$8c601080$@trmiles.com>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> >>
> >> Frank,
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Direct combustion options include steam, Stirling engines, and organic
> >> Rankine cycle (ORC) turbines. The challenge we have with these options is
> >> cost, especially at the small scale. We did a recent comparison of the
> >> feasibility at the 2 MWe scale and found that steam was the most cost
> >> effective compared with ORC or Stirling.
> >>
> >>
> >> Tom
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> From: Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org] On Behalf Of
> >> Frank Shields
> >> Sent: Monday, May 13, 2013 10:55 AM
> >> To: 'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'
> >> Subject: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Stovers,
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Seems there is often a lot of wasted energy that could be used when making
> >> char that is just flared off.
> >>
> >> I'm thinking the reason is that to convert to electricity one needs 1) a
> >> very clean syngas 2) an expensive motor and 3) costly up-keep. The
> >> generator
> >> is a onetime purchase with low maintenance.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> So why not use a steam engine to convert the flame to electricity? Perhaps
> >> not as efficient but all you are doing is heating water so the gas need not
> >> be as clean as when drawn into an internal combustion engine.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Frank
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Frank Shields
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> BioChar Division
> >>
> >> Control Laboratories, Inc.
> >>
> >> 42 Hangar Way
> >>
> >> Watsonville, CE 95076
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> (831) 724-5422 tel
> >>
> >> (81) 724-3188 fax
> >>
> >> frank at biocharlab.com
> >>
> >> www.controllabs.com
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >> URL: <
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/e13357fe/attachment-0001.html
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 3
> >> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 05:38:24 +0530
> >> From: Nariphaltan <nariphaltan at gmail.com>
> >> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >> Cc: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >> Message-ID: <20FCC1E5-3350-4223-BC13-4091D9C20481 at gmail.com>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> >>
> >> Have a look at this "char making machine".
> >> www.nariphaltan.org/Gasifier.pdf
> >>
> >> Cheers.
> >>
> >> Anil K Rajvanshi
> >>
> >> Sent from my iPad
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 13-May-2013, at 11:24 PM, "Frank Shields" <frank at compostlab.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Stovers,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Seems there is often a lot of wasted energy that could be used when
> >> making char that is just flared off.
> >>> I?m thinking the reason is that to convert to electricity one needs 1) a
> >> very clean syngas 2) an expensive motor and 3) costly up-keep. The
> >> generator is a onetime purchase with low maintenance.
> >>>
> >>> So why not use a steam engine to convert the flame to electricity?
> >> Perhaps not as efficient but all you are doing is heating water so the gas
> >> need not be as clean as when drawn into an internal combustion engine.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Thanks
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Frank
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Thanks
> >>>
> >>> Frank Shields
> >>>
> >>> BioChar Division
> >>> Control Laboratories, Inc.
> >>> 42 Hangar Way
> >>> Watsonville, CE 95076
> >>>
> >>> (831) 724-5422 tel
> >>> (81) 724-3188 fax
> >>> frank at biocharlab.com
> >>> www.controllabs.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>
> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >> URL: <
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/f0557ccc/attachment-0001.html
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 4
> >> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 08:23:23 +0700
> >> From: Tuong DoDuc <tuong.do at devi-renewable.com>
> >> To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >> Subject: [Stoves] Continuous gasifier for household scale - experience
> >> sharing
> >> Message-ID:
> >> <CAJaUSMNHfwozi-gjuzetBwKen0AAKQDLJPgRu916ejYW=
> >> L7vuA at mail.gmail.com>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> >>
> >> Dear Dr.TLUD, Paul Oliver, and others,
> >>
> >> The team in SNV Vietnam is adopting the continous gasifier model developed
> >> by Belonio. The manual has been obtained from the CRHET.
> >> Watch our first propotype: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQGS-VQIj5M
> >> We were able to control the fire, load fuel without affecting the fire, and
> >> easily remove char at the bottom of the reactor.
> >>
> >> We also adopted the computer fan-casing by a cheaper, more popular fan in
> >> Vietnam (often used for coal and fixed wood stove). Fan costed 2USD (while
> >> to replicate Belonio's fan-casing, we bought the adapter for 5USD and a
> >> computer fan for 1.5USD)
> >>
> >> However, this is just our first step and we still have so many problems to
> >> fully control the fire and ease the operation.
> >> 1) For instance, uncontrolled moment happened when combustion occurs rigt
> >> on top of the fuel hopper, a lot of smoke was produced and later the fire
> >> burnt the fan.
> >> https://www.dropbox.com/s/43fkjs0axuye4oj/uncontrollable_moment.jpg
> >> https://www.dropbox.com/s/rd1g1cg0a9ue8qt/fan_casing.jpg
> >>
> >> 2) Another problem is that a lot of tar is produced. It deposits on pot
> >> bottom, burner and other part of the stove. That would also harm the user.
> >> An idea is to create a layer of char in the burner pipe (to filter the
> >> tar). Not tried yet.
> >>
> >> 3) We observes 5-10% of the gas leaked out through the char removal door.
> >> We burnt them, but user may not know (or they simply just don't care) that
> >> it is toxic.
> >>
> >> 4) One more, it is very hard to control the final minutes of the
> >> gasificatoin process. It always cause inverted combustion to the fuel
> >> hopper.
> >>
> >> By this email, I would like to ask if some of you have done similar work
> >> with continuous gasifier like this to share more experience. We can thus
> >> reduce our time and effort in localizing this technology.
> >>
> >> Best regards,
> >>
> >> Do Duc Tuong,
> >>
> >> Renewable Energy Advisor
> >> SNV Vietnam
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >> URL: <
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/a58467e3/attachment-0001.html
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 5
> >> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 02:55:28 +0000 (UTC)
> >> From: rongretlarson at comcast.net
> >> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>, Biochar-production
> >> <Biochar-production at yahoogroups.com>
> >> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >> Message-ID:
> >> <
> >> 1707234733.1840621.1368500128336.JavaMail.root at sz0133a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net
> >>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> >>
> >> Dr. Rajvanshi: cc stoves and adding "bochar-production"
> >>
> >> Thanks for sending us this report. A few questions
> >>
> >> a. This work was done in the mid '90's. What has happened recently with
> >> this or similar equipment in India or your part of India? Can one now buy
> >> such hardware?
> >>
> >> b. What caused NARI to design a pyrolyzer rather than a combustor?
> >>
> >> c. In the Abstract, you said the char "... .can be used as a soil
> >> conditioner ." This would have been very early in the history of what we
> >> now call "biochar". Was there then a market near Phaltan for such? Now?
> >>
> >> d. Your economics section does not show a price for char. Can you
> >> guesstimate the relative value then and now for the char?
> >>
> >> Congratulations for what appears to have been a successful design - ahead
> >> of its time..
> >>
> >> Ron
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "Nariphaltan" <nariphaltan at gmail.com>
> >> To: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >> Cc: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >> Sent: Monday, May 13, 2013 6:08:24 PM
> >> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>
> >>
> >> Have a look at this "char making machine".
> >> www.nariphaltan.org/Gasifier.pdf
> >>
> >>
> >> Cheers.
> >>
> >> Anil K Rajvanshi
> >>
> >>
> >> Sent from my iPad
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 13-May-2013, at 11:24 PM, "Frank Shields" < frank at compostlab.com >
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Stovers,
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Seems there is often a lot of wasted energy that could be used when making
> >> char that is just flared off.
> >>
> >> I?m thinking the reason is that to convert to electricity one needs 1) a
> >> very clean syngas 2) an expensive motor and 3) costly up-keep. The
> >> generator is a onetime purchase with low maintenance.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> So why not use a steam engine to convert the flame to electricity? Perhaps
> >> not as efficient but all you are doing is heating water so the gas need not
> >> be as clean as when drawn into an internal combustion engine.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Frank
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Frank Shields
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> BioChar Division
> >>
> >> Control Laboratories, Inc.
> >>
> >> 42 Hangar Way
> >>
> >> Watsonville, CE 95076
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> (831) 724-5422 tel
> >>
> >> (81) 724-3188 fax
> >>
> >> frank at biocharlab.com
> >>
> >> www.controllabs.com
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> <blockquote>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Stoves mailing list
> >>
> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>
> >>
> >> </blockquote>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Stoves mailing list
> >>
> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >> URL: <
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/6088e3b2/attachment-0001.html
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 6
> >> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 10:12:56 +0700
> >> From: Paul Olivier <paul.olivier at esrla.com>
> >> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Continuous gasifier for household scale -
> >> experience sharing
> >> Message-ID:
> >> <
> >> CAOreFvYL5d29-W4JdwJ9BHOmkkyzh2oDNKM-wp37xgGCbRhtBQ at mail.gmail.com>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> >>
> >> The moment one goes from batch to continuous, the process gets really
> >> complicated. Nothing beats the simplicity of a static batch reactor.
> >> It provides ideal gasification conditions. The problem regarding the
> >> length of the batch cycle can be overcome if the fuel is densified. If
> >> the reactor is filled with pellets, the length of the cycle can be
> >> extended to well over five hours. Imagine: for a five full hours, the
> >> operator does not have to intervene. There is no loading of rice hulls
> >> or scrapping out of biochar during this entire period.
> >>
> >> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/22013094/Paper/Presentations/Gasification.ppsx
> >> The time to empty, reload and relight a batch reactor is less than one
> >> minute.
> >> Several reactor tubes can be operated at the same time.
> >>
> >> Thanks.
> >> Paul Olivier
> >>
> >>
> >> On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 8:23 AM, Tuong DoDuc
> >> <tuong.do at devi-renewable.com> wrote:
> >>> Dear Dr.TLUD, Paul Oliver, and others,
> >>>
> >>> The team in SNV Vietnam is adopting the continous gasifier model
> >> developed
> >>> by Belonio. The manual has been obtained from the CRHET.
> >>> Watch our first propotype: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQGS-VQIj5M
> >>> We were able to control the fire, load fuel without affecting the fire,
> >> and
> >>> easily remove char at the bottom of the reactor.
> >>>
> >>> We also adopted the computer fan-casing by a cheaper, more popular fan in
> >>> Vietnam (often used for coal and fixed wood stove). Fan costed 2USD
> >> (while
> >>> to replicate Belonio's fan-casing, we bought the adapter for 5USD and a
> >>> computer fan for 1.5USD)
> >>>
> >>> However, this is just our first step and we still have so many problems
> >> to
> >>> fully control the fire and ease the operation.
> >>> 1) For instance, uncontrolled moment happened when combustion occurs
> >> rigt on
> >>> top of the fuel hopper, a lot of smoke was produced and later the fire
> >> burnt
> >>> the fan.
> >>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/43fkjs0axuye4oj/uncontrollable_moment.jpg
> >>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/rd1g1cg0a9ue8qt/fan_casing.jpg
> >>>
> >>> 2) Another problem is that a lot of tar is produced. It deposits on pot
> >>> bottom, burner and other part of the stove. That would also harm the
> >> user.
> >>> An idea is to create a layer of char in the burner pipe (to filter the
> >> tar).
> >>> Not tried yet.
> >>>
> >>> 3) We observes 5-10% of the gas leaked out through the char removal
> >> door. We
> >>> burnt them, but user may not know (or they simply just don't care) that
> >> it
> >>> is toxic.
> >>>
> >>> 4) One more, it is very hard to control the final minutes of the
> >>> gasificatoin process. It always cause inverted combustion to the fuel
> >>> hopper.
> >>>
> >>> By this email, I would like to ask if some of you have done similar work
> >>> with continuous gasifier like this to share more experience. We can thus
> >>> reduce our time and effort in localizing this technology.
> >>>
> >>> Best regards,
> >>>
> >>> Do Duc Tuong,
> >>>
> >>> Renewable Energy Advisor
> >>> SNV Vietnam
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>
> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Paul A. Olivier PhD
> >> 26/5 Phu Dong Thien Vuong
> >> Dalat
> >> Vietnam
> >>
> >> Louisiana telephone: 1-337-447-4124 (rings Vietnam)
> >> Mobile: 090-694-1573 (in Vietnam)
> >> Skype address: Xpolivier
> >> http://www.esrla.com/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 7
> >> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 18:03:54 +0700
> >> From: Tuong DoDuc <tuong.do at devi-renewable.com>
> >> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Continuous gasifier for household scale -
> >> experience sharing
> >> Message-ID:
> >> <
> >> CAJaUSMON7XTbFRSgU5Q-Nv9j8pqFa2uyFvakoBN2QqLVthp+pw at mail.gmail.com>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> >>
> >> Thanks Paul Oliver,
> >>
> >> I went through your presentation several times before.
> >> I must say that It is very convincing and inspiring as well.
> >>
> >> Regarding the continous feed concept, I think it is a trade-off.
> >> One one side, we will tell the users all the pros anc cons and let them
> >> decide to choose what they like.
> >> In this case, we will leave several different options for the users by a
> >> field test of different gasifier models.
> >> The user will tell. At this development stage of the continuous gasifier, I
> >> can't tell which (batch or continuous) suits the user most. Especially,
> >> there is no one-size-fits-all solution
> >>
> >> Best regards,
> >>
> >> Tuong
> >>
> >>
> >> On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 10:12 AM, Paul Olivier <paul.olivier at esrla.com
> >>> wrote:
> >>
> >>> The moment one goes from batch to continuous, the process gets really
> >>> complicated. Nothing beats the simplicity of a static batch reactor.
> >>> It provides ideal gasification conditions. The problem regarding the
> >>> length of the batch cycle can be overcome if the fuel is densified. If
> >>> the reactor is filled with pellets, the length of the cycle can be
> >>> extended to well over five hours. Imagine: for a five full hours, the
> >>> operator does not have to intervene. There is no loading of rice hulls
> >>> or scrapping out of biochar during this entire period.
> >> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/22013094/Paper/Presentations/Gasification.ppsx
> >>> The time to empty, reload and relight a batch reactor is less than one
> >>> minute.
> >>> Several reactor tubes can be operated at the same time.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks.
> >>> Paul Olivier
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 8:23 AM, Tuong DoDuc
> >>> <tuong.do at devi-renewable.com> wrote:
> >>>> Dear Dr.TLUD, Paul Oliver, and others,
> >>>>
> >>>> The team in SNV Vietnam is adopting the continous gasifier model
> >>> developed
> >>>> by Belonio. The manual has been obtained from the CRHET.
> >>>> Watch our first propotype: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQGS-VQIj5M
> >>>> We were able to control the fire, load fuel without affecting the fire,
> >>> and
> >>>> easily remove char at the bottom of the reactor.
> >>>>
> >>>> We also adopted the computer fan-casing by a cheaper, more popular fan
> >> in
> >>>> Vietnam (often used for coal and fixed wood stove). Fan costed 2USD
> >>> (while
> >>>> to replicate Belonio's fan-casing, we bought the adapter for 5USD and a
> >>>> computer fan for 1.5USD)
> >>>>
> >>>> However, this is just our first step and we still have so many problems
> >>> to
> >>>> fully control the fire and ease the operation.
> >>>> 1) For instance, uncontrolled moment happened when combustion occurs
> >>> rigt on
> >>>> top of the fuel hopper, a lot of smoke was produced and later the fire
> >>> burnt
> >>>> the fan.
> >>>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/43fkjs0axuye4oj/uncontrollable_moment.jpg
> >>>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/rd1g1cg0a9ue8qt/fan_casing.jpg
> >>>>
> >>>> 2) Another problem is that a lot of tar is produced. It deposits on pot
> >>>> bottom, burner and other part of the stove. That would also harm the
> >>> user.
> >>>> An idea is to create a layer of char in the burner pipe (to filter the
> >>> tar).
> >>>> Not tried yet.
> >>>>
> >>>> 3) We observes 5-10% of the gas leaked out through the char removal
> >>> door. We
> >>>> burnt them, but user may not know (or they simply just don't care) that
> >>> it
> >>>> is toxic.
> >>>>
> >>>> 4) One more, it is very hard to control the final minutes of the
> >>>> gasificatoin process. It always cause inverted combustion to the fuel
> >>>> hopper.
> >>>>
> >>>> By this email, I would like to ask if some of you have done similar
> >> work
> >>>> with continuous gasifier like this to share more experience. We can
> >> thus
> >>>> reduce our time and effort in localizing this technology.
> >>>>
> >>>> Best regards,
> >>>>
> >>>> Do Duc Tuong,
> >>>>
> >>>> Renewable Energy Advisor
> >>>> SNV Vietnam
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>>
> >>>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web
> >> site:
> >>>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Paul A. Olivier PhD
> >>> 26/5 Phu Dong Thien Vuong
> >>> Dalat
> >>> Vietnam
> >>>
> >>> Louisiana telephone: 1-337-447-4124 (rings Vietnam)
> >>> Mobile: 090-694-1573 (in Vietnam)
> >>> Skype address: Xpolivier
> >>> http://www.esrla.com/
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>
> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >> URL: <
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/9182fc38/attachment-0001.html
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 8
> >> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 16:39:47 +0530
> >> From: Nariphaltan <nariphaltan at gmail.com>
> >> To: "rongretlarson at comcast.net" <rongretlarson at comcast.net>
> >> Cc: Biochar-production <Biochar-production at yahoogroups.com>,
> >> Discussion of biomass cooking stoves <
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >> Message-ID: <B08F79A0-7233-4B92-A188-A7C5BA79BB21 at gmail.com>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> >>
> >> Dear Ron,
> >>
> >> Thanks for your mail. We did this work when very few people were
> >> interested in loose leafy gasifier. It was designed so that the flow is
> >> smooth and hence the best strategy was to pyrolyse the biomass rather than
> >> gasify it. In the process we also generated 25% char (w/w feed basis).
> >> Since we are an agricultural research Institute hence we thought of using
> >> this char as a soil conditioner. This was in 1990-1992. Because of the
> >> pioneer nature of this work the gasifier together with the char in the
> >> field was on cover of International Journal of Biomass Energy (David Hall
> >> used to be the editor of the Journal).
> >>
> >> Why we left this work? This is a long story but we moved on to other
> >> things and partly because no body was interested in the biomass research at
> >> that time.
> >>
> >> Still I think Our work can be inspiration to lots of people.
> >>
> >> All the best.
> >>
> >> Anil
> >>
> >> Anil K Rajvanshi
> >>
> >> Sent from my iPad
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 14-May-2013, at 8:25 AM, rongretlarson at comcast.net wrote:
> >>
> >>> Dr. Rajvanshi: cc stoves and adding "bochar-production"
> >>>
> >>> Thanks for sending us this report. A few questions
> >>>
> >>> a. This work was done in the mid '90's. What has happened recently
> >> with this or similar equipment in India or your part of India? Can one
> >> now buy such hardware?
> >>>
> >>> b. What caused NARI to design a pyrolyzer rather than a combustor?
> >>>
> >>> c. In the Abstract, you said the char "....can be used as a soil
> >> conditioner." This would have been very early in the history of what we
> >> now call "biochar". Was there then a market near Phaltan for such? Now?
> >>>
> >>> d. Your economics section does not show a price for char. Can you
> >> guesstimate the relative value then and now for the char?
> >>>
> >>> Congratulations for what appears to have been a successful design -
> >> ahead of its time..
> >>>
> >>> Ron
> >>>
> >>> From: "Nariphaltan" <nariphaltan at gmail.com>
> >>> To: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>> Cc: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>> Sent: Monday, May 13, 2013 6:08:24 PM
> >>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>>
> >>> Have a look at this "char making machine".
> >> www.nariphaltan.org/Gasifier.pdf
> >>>
> >>> Cheers.
> >>>
> >>> Anil K Rajvanshi
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPad
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On 13-May-2013, at 11:24 PM, "Frank Shields" <frank at compostlab.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Stovers,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Seems there is often a lot of wasted energy that could be used when
> >> making char that is just flared off.
> >>> I?m thinking the reason is that to convert to electricity one needs 1) a
> >> very clean syngas 2) an expensive motor and 3) costly up-keep. The
> >> generator is a onetime purchase with low maintenance.
> >>>
> >>> So why not use a steam engine to convert the flame to electricity?
> >> Perhaps not as efficient but all you are doing is heating water so the gas
> >> need not be as clean as when drawn into an internal combustion engine.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Thanks
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Frank
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Thanks
> >>>
> >>> Frank Shields
> >>>
> >>> BioChar Division
> >>> Control Laboratories, Inc.
> >>> 42 Hangar Way
> >>> Watsonville, CE 95076
> >>>
> >>> (831) 724-5422 tel
> >>> (81) 724-3188 fax
> >>> frank at biocharlab.com
> >>> www.controllabs.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>
> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>
> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >> URL: <
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/88a3f211/attachment-0001.html
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 9
> >> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 07:56:44 -0700
> >> From: "Tom Miles" <tmiles at trmiles.com>
> >> To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'"
> >> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>, <rongretlarson at comcast.net
> >> Cc: 'Biochar-production' <Biochar-production at yahoogroups.com>
> >> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >> Message-ID: <00a301ce50b3$40e683e0$c2b38ba0$@trmiles.com>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> >>
> >> Anil,
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks for bringing this out.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> At the time (1975-1995) there were efforts to convert straws and crop
> >> residues to energy, particularly in France (at AFME, CEMAGREF, Pillard,
> >> etc.). In most cases the char was considered a potential domestic fuel
> >> rather than for agriculture. European demand for charcoal was high. French
> >> wood pyrolysis and gasification plants were still in operation and in
> >> development. (The downdraft gasifier that we associate with Hitler was
> >> invented in France in the 1930s.)
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> As you remember David Hall made a concerted effort to improve
> >> carbonization and energy systems in agriculture.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Tom
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> From: Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org] On Behalf
> >> Of Nariphaltan
> >> Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 4:10 AM
> >> To: rongretlarson at comcast.net
> >> Cc: Biochar-production; Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Dear Ron,
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks for your mail. We did this work when very few people were
> >> interested in loose leafy gasifier. It was designed so that the flow is
> >> smooth and hence the best strategy was to pyrolyse the biomass rather than
> >> gasify it. In the process we also generated 25% char (w/w feed basis).
> >> Since we are an agricultural research Institute hence we thought of using
> >> this char as a soil conditioner. This was in 1990-1992. Because of the
> >> pioneer nature of this work the gasifier together with the char in the
> >> field was on cover of International Journal of Biomass Energy (David Hall
> >> used to be the editor of the Journal).
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Why we left this work? This is a long story but we moved on to other
> >> things and partly because no body was interested in the biomass research at
> >> that time.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Still I think Our work can be inspiration to lots of people.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> All the best.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Anil
> >>
> >> Anil K Rajvanshi
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Sent from my iPad
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 14-May-2013, at 8:25 AM, rongretlarson at comcast.net wrote:
> >>
> >> Dr. Rajvanshi: cc stoves and adding "bochar-production"
> >>
> >> Thanks for sending us this report. A few questions
> >>
> >> a. This work was done in the mid '90's. What has happened recently with
> >> this or similar equipment in India or your part of India? Can one now buy
> >> such hardware?
> >>
> >> b. What caused NARI to design a pyrolyzer rather than a combustor?
> >>
> >> c. In the Abstract, you said the char "....can be used as a soil
> >> conditioner." This would have been very early in the history of what we
> >> now call "biochar". Was there then a market near Phaltan for such? Now?
> >>
> >> d. Your economics section does not show a price for char. Can you
> >> guesstimate the relative value then and now for the char?
> >>
> >> Congratulations for what appears to have been a successful design -
> >> ahead of its time..
> >>
> >> Ron
> >>
> >>
> >> _____
> >>
> >>
> >> From: "Nariphaltan" <nariphaltan at gmail.com>
> >> To: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >> Cc: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >> Sent: Monday, May 13, 2013 6:08:24 PM
> >> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>
> >> Have a look at this "char making machine".
> >> www.nariphaltan.org/Gasifier.pdf
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Cheers.
> >>
> >> Anil K Rajvanshi
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Sent from my iPad
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 13-May-2013, at 11:24 PM, "Frank Shields" <frank at compostlab.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> Stovers,
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Seems there is often a lot of wasted energy that could be used when making
> >> char that is just flared off.
> >>
> >> I?m thinking the reason is that to convert to electricity one needs 1) a
> >> very clean syngas 2) an expensive motor and 3) costly up-keep. The
> >> generator is a onetime purchase with low maintenance.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> So why not use a steam engine to convert the flame to electricity? Perhaps
> >> not as efficient but all you are doing is heating water so the gas need not
> >> be as clean as when drawn into an internal combustion engine.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Frank
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Frank Shields
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> BioChar Division
> >>
> >> Control Laboratories, Inc.
> >>
> >> 42 Hangar Way
> >>
> >> Watsonville, CE 95076
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> (831) 724-5422 tel
> >>
> >> (81) 724-3188 fax
> >>
> >> frank at biocharlab.com
> >>
> >> www.controllabs.com
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Stoves mailing list
> >>
> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Stoves mailing list
> >>
> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >> URL: <
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/67811ee2/attachment.html
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> Subject: Digest Footer
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Stoves mailing list
> >>
> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >>
> >> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >> http://www.bioenergylists.org/
> >>
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> End of Stoves Digest, Vol 33, Issue 18
> >> **************************************
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Art Donnelly
> > President SeaChar.Org
> > US Director, The Farm Stove Project
> > Proyecto Estufa Finca
> > <http://email2.globalgiving.org/wf/click?c=1Oy%2FmZbgIyjS5WI580KXwShvfKBcF2eaJvtN7Pi6p7Jl%2FiR4938EMMCBwY%2FuYALeA%2BQYUWN4RpvnxBsBC7e2%2BGIHcONTozBmvsUU5LTL%2FTNk4Q3vxE%2BKdXTV2cxIsFplSPh%2F9nMG3bQMQf4bz9ZK9SHMy46Z8OPLAtMAnPG9SKkPuLCWvofBTLC%2BImqax%2BZTkkF2RvDri5UdgH19NHjHOBj5WMUrS4L62Z2xxUJbBsJdDUOfeifheNFXH546Xm0yul4P2stm%2FTUOJxYnI0nFjXEaYfzxDSc%2FwgqVkR1t0USDHk30%2Fgt9UpDpyzLj37HWtnNQ0q8Jh1gZCkB4Y1Fgbg394gYFkyNqFN4MchxO2Js%3D&rp=wrhiOr2wAxUyDMDlMSqbOkKa0FpPoiCSHffb%2ByfHGClRxIFjEIrUDwAF%2BFD%2BpAPuvam9BDwvSMcadhFv7aFwKoyAXYrFk00%2B92xPIeMHXaTDJ3x0VIj6ZYwjm1win65o&up=YDTqBOjidbCUo%2Far1oAtZjp5ji73zPEvmoO14mevuXzIDUdb6Ac9W13SPOXmzL5NflZkH0HxLp0v4dT9UwEHDV0wSZ1qusv09bIKkUliWs4%3D&u=LHuflw_1TAib_lgCu2JvQw%2Fh0>
> > "SeaChar.Org...positive tools for carbon negative living"
> > -------------- next part --------------
> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> > URL: <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/31d6ae8f/attachment-0001.html>
> > -------------- next part --------------
> > A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> > Name: TLUD heat exchanger test firing.jpg
> > Type: image/jpeg
> > Size: 70955 bytes
> > Desc: not available
> > URL: <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/31d6ae8f/attachment-0001.jpg>
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 2
> > Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 09:01:49 -0700
> > From: Francesco Tortorici <francescot at gmail.com>
> > To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> > <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> > Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> > Message-ID:
> > <CAKiNAwVCYO6tYH8xk+5YsTrKsbbRSnskHgsduSZq2k7Sx1az+A at mail.gmail.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> >
> > Art,
> >
> > Please have them contact me directly. We would be happy to share with them.
> > Francesco
> >
> >
> > On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 8:50 AM, Art Donnelly <art.donnelly at seachar.org>wrote:
> >
> >> Hi all,
> >> Francesco, that's a nice looking setup. SeaChar has a couple of volunteers
> >> (bi-lingual) in Costa Rica that want to do the same thing. Can we introduce
> >> them to your friends and set-up an information exchange?
> >> Also, I have attached a photo of our "in progress" TLUD heat exchanger. It
> >> will be used to dry cacao beans.
> >> Our goal is to make every BTU count.
> >> Art Donnelly
> >>
> >>
> >> On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 8:56 AM, <stoves-request at lists.bioenergylists.org>wrote:
> >>
> >>> Send Stoves mailing list submissions to
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> >>>
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> >>> stoves-request at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> You can reach the person managing the list at
> >>> stoves-owner at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> >>> than "Re: Contents of Stoves digest..."
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Today's Topics:
> >>>
> >>> 1. Re: Using all the energy when char making (Francesco Tortorici)
> >>> 2. Re: Using all the energy when char making (Tom Miles)
> >>> 3. Re: Using all the energy when char making (Nariphaltan)
> >>> 4. Continuous gasifier for household scale - experience sharing
> >>> (Tuong DoDuc)
> >>> 5. Re: Using all the energy when char making
> >>> (rongretlarson at comcast.net)
> >>> 6. Re: Continuous gasifier for household scale - experience
> >>> sharing (Paul Olivier)
> >>> 7. Re: Continuous gasifier for household scale - experience
> >>> sharing (Tuong DoDuc)
> >>> 8. Re: Using all the energy when char making (Nariphaltan)
> >>> 9. Re: Using all the energy when char making (Tom Miles)
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> Message: 1
> >>> Date: Mon, 13 May 2013 11:13:42 -0700
> >>> From: Francesco Tortorici <francescot at gmail.com>
> >>> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >>> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>> Message-ID:
> >>> <CAKiNAwXcz9yYu3Gh4=dbb8=
> >>> z-3QuWps6+yWtrCGmwu-A8oKZDQ at mail.gmail.com>
> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
> >>>
> >>> Here is an example of a local mushroom grower that uses a TLUD to
> >>> pasteurize straw. Previously he used propane, but now uses his gasifier
> >>> stove. The biochar produced is "charged" with worm castings and worm tea
> >>> that is also a "byproduct' of his mushroom business.
> >>>
> >>> This is an example of of having a need for the heat and the willingness to
> >>> try something different. His operation is small and located on the
> >>> Olympic Peninsula of Washington State.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 10:54 AM, Frank Shields <frank at compostlab.com
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> *Stovers,*
> >>>>
> >>>> * *
> >>>>
> >>>> * *
> >>>>
> >>>> *Seems there is often a lot of wasted energy that could be used when
> >>>> making char that is just flared off. *
> >>>>
> >>>> *I?m thinking the reason is that to convert to electricity one needs 1)
> >>> a
> >>>> very clean syngas 2) an expensive motor and 3) costly up-keep. The
> >>>> generator is a onetime purchase with low maintenance.*
> >>>>
> >>>> * *
> >>>>
> >>>> *So why not use a steam engine to convert the flame to electricity?
> >>>> Perhaps not as efficient but all you are doing is heating water so the
> >>> gas
> >>>> need not be as clean as when drawn into an internal combustion engine. *
> >>>>
> >>>> * *
> >>>>
> >>>> * *
> >>>>
> >>>> *Thanks*
> >>>>
> >>>> * *
> >>>>
> >>>> * *
> >>>>
> >>>> *Frank *
> >>>>
> >>>> * *
> >>>>
> >>>> * *
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks ****
> >>>>
> >>>> ** **
> >>>>
> >>>> Frank Shields****
> >>>>
> >>>> ** **
> >>>>
> >>>> BioChar Division****
> >>>>
> >>>> Control Laboratories, Inc. ****
> >>>>
> >>>> 42 Hangar Way****
> >>>>
> >>>> Watsonville, CE 95076****
> >>>>
> >>>> ** **
> >>>>
> >>>> (831) 724-5422 tel****
> >>>>
> >>>> (81) 724-3188 fax****
> >>>>
> >>>> frank at biocharlab.com****
> >>>>
> >>>> www.controllabs.com****
> >>>>
> >>>> * *
> >>>>
> >>>> * *
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>>
> >>>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>> -------------- next part --------------
> >>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >>> URL: <
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/581f8a8a/attachment-0001.html
> >>> -------------- next part --------------
> >>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> >>> Name: 0. 6-29-12 Fan.jpg
> >>> Type: image/jpeg
> >>> Size: 117950 bytes
> >>> Desc: not available
> >>> URL: <
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/581f8a8a/attachment-0005.jpg
> >>> -------------- next part --------------
> >>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> >>> Name: 2. 7-18-12 Max Burn.jpg
> >>> Type: image/jpeg
> >>> Size: 90033 bytes
> >>> Desc: not available
> >>> URL: <
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/581f8a8a/attachment-0006.jpg
> >>> -------------- next part --------------
> >>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> >>> Name: 3. 6-29-12 Straw.jpg
> >>> Type: image/jpeg
> >>> Size: 78759 bytes
> >>> Desc: not available
> >>> URL: <
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/581f8a8a/attachment-0007.jpg
> >>> -------------- next part --------------
> >>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> >>> Name: 4. 7-18-12 Post Burn.jpg
> >>> Type: image/jpeg
> >>> Size: 111959 bytes
> >>> Desc: not available
> >>> URL: <
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/581f8a8a/attachment-0008.jpg
> >>> -------------- next part --------------
> >>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> >>> Name: 5. 7-18-12 BioChar.jpg
> >>> Type: image/jpeg
> >>> Size: 128846 bytes
> >>> Desc: not available
> >>> URL: <
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/581f8a8a/attachment-0009.jpg
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> Message: 2
> >>> Date: Mon, 13 May 2013 11:20:14 -0700
> >>> From: "Tom Miles" <tmiles at trmiles.com>
> >>> To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'"
> >>> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>> Message-ID: <013901ce5006$84200580$8c601080$@trmiles.com>
> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> >>>
> >>> Frank,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Direct combustion options include steam, Stirling engines, and organic
> >>> Rankine cycle (ORC) turbines. The challenge we have with these options is
> >>> cost, especially at the small scale. We did a recent comparison of the
> >>> feasibility at the 2 MWe scale and found that steam was the most cost
> >>> effective compared with ORC or Stirling.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Tom
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> From: Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org] On Behalf
> >>> Of
> >>> Frank Shields
> >>> Sent: Monday, May 13, 2013 10:55 AM
> >>> To: 'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'
> >>> Subject: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Stovers,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Seems there is often a lot of wasted energy that could be used when making
> >>> char that is just flared off.
> >>>
> >>> I'm thinking the reason is that to convert to electricity one needs 1) a
> >>> very clean syngas 2) an expensive motor and 3) costly up-keep. The
> >>> generator
> >>> is a onetime purchase with low maintenance.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> So why not use a steam engine to convert the flame to electricity? Perhaps
> >>> not as efficient but all you are doing is heating water so the gas need
> >>> not
> >>> be as clean as when drawn into an internal combustion engine.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Thanks
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Frank
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Thanks
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Frank Shields
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> BioChar Division
> >>>
> >>> Control Laboratories, Inc.
> >>>
> >>> 42 Hangar Way
> >>>
> >>> Watsonville, CE 95076
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> (831) 724-5422 tel
> >>>
> >>> (81) 724-3188 fax
> >>>
> >>> frank at biocharlab.com
> >>>
> >>> www.controllabs.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -------------- next part --------------
> >>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >>> URL: <
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130513/e13357fe/attachment-0001.html
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> Message: 3
> >>> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 05:38:24 +0530
> >>> From: Nariphaltan <nariphaltan at gmail.com>
> >>> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >>> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>> Cc: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >>> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>> Message-ID: <20FCC1E5-3350-4223-BC13-4091D9C20481 at gmail.com>
> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> >>>
> >>> Have a look at this "char making machine".
> >>> www.nariphaltan.org/Gasifier.pdf
> >>>
> >>> Cheers.
> >>>
> >>> Anil K Rajvanshi
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPad
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On 13-May-2013, at 11:24 PM, "Frank Shields" <frank at compostlab.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Stovers,
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Seems there is often a lot of wasted energy that could be used when
> >>> making char that is just flared off.
> >>>> I?m thinking the reason is that to convert to electricity one needs 1)
> >>> a very clean syngas 2) an expensive motor and 3) costly up-keep. The
> >>> generator is a onetime purchase with low maintenance.
> >>>>
> >>>> So why not use a steam engine to convert the flame to electricity?
> >>> Perhaps not as efficient but all you are doing is heating water so the gas
> >>> need not be as clean as when drawn into an internal combustion engine.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Frank
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks
> >>>>
> >>>> Frank Shields
> >>>>
> >>>> BioChar Division
> >>>> Control Laboratories, Inc.
> >>>> 42 Hangar Way
> >>>> Watsonville, CE 95076
> >>>>
> >>>> (831) 724-5422 tel
> >>>> (81) 724-3188 fax
> >>>> frank at biocharlab.com
> >>>> www.controllabs.com
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>>
> >>>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>> -------------- next part --------------
> >>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >>> URL: <
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/f0557ccc/attachment-0001.html
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> Message: 4
> >>> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 08:23:23 +0700
> >>> From: Tuong DoDuc <tuong.do at devi-renewable.com>
> >>> To: stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>> Subject: [Stoves] Continuous gasifier for household scale - experience
> >>> sharing
> >>> Message-ID:
> >>> <CAJaUSMNHfwozi-gjuzetBwKen0AAKQDLJPgRu916ejYW=
> >>> L7vuA at mail.gmail.com>
> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> >>>
> >>> Dear Dr.TLUD, Paul Oliver, and others,
> >>>
> >>> The team in SNV Vietnam is adopting the continous gasifier model developed
> >>> by Belonio. The manual has been obtained from the CRHET.
> >>> Watch our first propotype: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQGS-VQIj5M
> >>> We were able to control the fire, load fuel without affecting the fire,
> >>> and
> >>> easily remove char at the bottom of the reactor.
> >>>
> >>> We also adopted the computer fan-casing by a cheaper, more popular fan in
> >>> Vietnam (often used for coal and fixed wood stove). Fan costed 2USD (while
> >>> to replicate Belonio's fan-casing, we bought the adapter for 5USD and a
> >>> computer fan for 1.5USD)
> >>>
> >>> However, this is just our first step and we still have so many problems to
> >>> fully control the fire and ease the operation.
> >>> 1) For instance, uncontrolled moment happened when combustion occurs rigt
> >>> on top of the fuel hopper, a lot of smoke was produced and later the fire
> >>> burnt the fan.
> >>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/43fkjs0axuye4oj/uncontrollable_moment.jpg
> >>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/rd1g1cg0a9ue8qt/fan_casing.jpg
> >>>
> >>> 2) Another problem is that a lot of tar is produced. It deposits on pot
> >>> bottom, burner and other part of the stove. That would also harm the user.
> >>> An idea is to create a layer of char in the burner pipe (to filter the
> >>> tar). Not tried yet.
> >>>
> >>> 3) We observes 5-10% of the gas leaked out through the char removal door.
> >>> We burnt them, but user may not know (or they simply just don't care) that
> >>> it is toxic.
> >>>
> >>> 4) One more, it is very hard to control the final minutes of the
> >>> gasificatoin process. It always cause inverted combustion to the fuel
> >>> hopper.
> >>>
> >>> By this email, I would like to ask if some of you have done similar work
> >>> with continuous gasifier like this to share more experience. We can thus
> >>> reduce our time and effort in localizing this technology.
> >>>
> >>> Best regards,
> >>>
> >>> Do Duc Tuong,
> >>>
> >>> Renewable Energy Advisor
> >>> SNV Vietnam
> >>> -------------- next part --------------
> >>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >>> URL: <
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/a58467e3/attachment-0001.html
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> Message: 5
> >>> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 02:55:28 +0000 (UTC)
> >>> From: rongretlarson at comcast.net
> >>> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >>> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>, Biochar-production
> >>> <Biochar-production at yahoogroups.com>
> >>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>> Message-ID:
> >>> <
> >>> 1707234733.1840621.1368500128336.JavaMail.root at sz0133a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net
> >>>
> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> >>>
> >>> Dr. Rajvanshi: cc stoves and adding "bochar-production"
> >>>
> >>> Thanks for sending us this report. A few questions
> >>>
> >>> a. This work was done in the mid '90's. What has happened recently with
> >>> this or similar equipment in India or your part of India? Can one now buy
> >>> such hardware?
> >>>
> >>> b. What caused NARI to design a pyrolyzer rather than a combustor?
> >>>
> >>> c. In the Abstract, you said the char "... .can be used as a soil
> >>> conditioner ." This would have been very early in the history of what we
> >>> now call "biochar". Was there then a market near Phaltan for such? Now?
> >>>
> >>> d. Your economics section does not show a price for char. Can you
> >>> guesstimate the relative value then and now for the char?
> >>>
> >>> Congratulations for what appears to have been a successful design - ahead
> >>> of its time..
> >>>
> >>> Ron
> >>>
> >>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>> From: "Nariphaltan" <nariphaltan at gmail.com>
> >>> To: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>> Cc: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>> Sent: Monday, May 13, 2013 6:08:24 PM
> >>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Have a look at this "char making machine".
> >>> www.nariphaltan.org/Gasifier.pdf
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Cheers.
> >>>
> >>> Anil K Rajvanshi
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPad
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On 13-May-2013, at 11:24 PM, "Frank Shields" < frank at compostlab.com >
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Stovers,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Seems there is often a lot of wasted energy that could be used when
> >>> making char that is just flared off.
> >>>
> >>> I?m thinking the reason is that to convert to electricity one needs 1) a
> >>> very clean syngas 2) an expensive motor and 3) costly up-keep. The
> >>> generator is a onetime purchase with low maintenance.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> So why not use a steam engine to convert the flame to electricity?
> >>> Perhaps not as efficient but all you are doing is heating water so the gas
> >>> need not be as clean as when drawn into an internal combustion engine.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Thanks
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Frank
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Thanks
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Frank Shields
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> BioChar Division
> >>>
> >>> Control Laboratories, Inc.
> >>>
> >>> 42 Hangar Way
> >>>
> >>> Watsonville, CE 95076
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> (831) 724-5422 tel
> >>>
> >>> (81) 724-3188 fax
> >>>
> >>> frank at biocharlab.com
> >>>
> >>> www.controllabs.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> <blockquote>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>
> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>>
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> </blockquote>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>
> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>>
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>>
> >>> -------------- next part --------------
> >>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >>> URL: <
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/6088e3b2/attachment-0001.html
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> Message: 6
> >>> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 10:12:56 +0700
> >>> From: Paul Olivier <paul.olivier at esrla.com>
> >>> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >>> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Continuous gasifier for household scale -
> >>> experience sharing
> >>> Message-ID:
> >>> <
> >>> CAOreFvYL5d29-W4JdwJ9BHOmkkyzh2oDNKM-wp37xgGCbRhtBQ at mail.gmail.com>
> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> >>>
> >>> The moment one goes from batch to continuous, the process gets really
> >>> complicated. Nothing beats the simplicity of a static batch reactor.
> >>> It provides ideal gasification conditions. The problem regarding the
> >>> length of the batch cycle can be overcome if the fuel is densified. If
> >>> the reactor is filled with pellets, the length of the cycle can be
> >>> extended to well over five hours. Imagine: for a five full hours, the
> >>> operator does not have to intervene. There is no loading of rice hulls
> >>> or scrapping out of biochar during this entire period.
> >>>
> >>> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/22013094/Paper/Presentations/Gasification.ppsx
> >>> The time to empty, reload and relight a batch reactor is less than one
> >>> minute.
> >>> Several reactor tubes can be operated at the same time.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks.
> >>> Paul Olivier
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 8:23 AM, Tuong DoDuc
> >>> <tuong.do at devi-renewable.com> wrote:
> >>>> Dear Dr.TLUD, Paul Oliver, and others,
> >>>>
> >>>> The team in SNV Vietnam is adopting the continous gasifier model
> >>> developed
> >>>> by Belonio. The manual has been obtained from the CRHET.
> >>>> Watch our first propotype: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQGS-VQIj5M
> >>>> We were able to control the fire, load fuel without affecting the fire,
> >>> and
> >>>> easily remove char at the bottom of the reactor.
> >>>>
> >>>> We also adopted the computer fan-casing by a cheaper, more popular fan
> >>> in
> >>>> Vietnam (often used for coal and fixed wood stove). Fan costed 2USD
> >>> (while
> >>>> to replicate Belonio's fan-casing, we bought the adapter for 5USD and a
> >>>> computer fan for 1.5USD)
> >>>>
> >>>> However, this is just our first step and we still have so many problems
> >>> to
> >>>> fully control the fire and ease the operation.
> >>>> 1) For instance, uncontrolled moment happened when combustion occurs
> >>> rigt on
> >>>> top of the fuel hopper, a lot of smoke was produced and later the fire
> >>> burnt
> >>>> the fan.
> >>>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/43fkjs0axuye4oj/uncontrollable_moment.jpg
> >>>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/rd1g1cg0a9ue8qt/fan_casing.jpg
> >>>>
> >>>> 2) Another problem is that a lot of tar is produced. It deposits on pot
> >>>> bottom, burner and other part of the stove. That would also harm the
> >>> user.
> >>>> An idea is to create a layer of char in the burner pipe (to filter the
> >>> tar).
> >>>> Not tried yet.
> >>>>
> >>>> 3) We observes 5-10% of the gas leaked out through the char removal
> >>> door. We
> >>>> burnt them, but user may not know (or they simply just don't care) that
> >>> it
> >>>> is toxic.
> >>>>
> >>>> 4) One more, it is very hard to control the final minutes of the
> >>>> gasificatoin process. It always cause inverted combustion to the fuel
> >>>> hopper.
> >>>>
> >>>> By this email, I would like to ask if some of you have done similar work
> >>>> with continuous gasifier like this to share more experience. We can thus
> >>>> reduce our time and effort in localizing this technology.
> >>>>
> >>>> Best regards,
> >>>>
> >>>> Do Duc Tuong,
> >>>>
> >>>> Renewable Energy Advisor
> >>>> SNV Vietnam
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>>
> >>>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Paul A. Olivier PhD
> >>> 26/5 Phu Dong Thien Vuong
> >>> Dalat
> >>> Vietnam
> >>>
> >>> Louisiana telephone: 1-337-447-4124 (rings Vietnam)
> >>> Mobile: 090-694-1573 (in Vietnam)
> >>> Skype address: Xpolivier
> >>> http://www.esrla.com/
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> Message: 7
> >>> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 18:03:54 +0700
> >>> From: Tuong DoDuc <tuong.do at devi-renewable.com>
> >>> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >>> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Continuous gasifier for household scale -
> >>> experience sharing
> >>> Message-ID:
> >>> <
> >>> CAJaUSMON7XTbFRSgU5Q-Nv9j8pqFa2uyFvakoBN2QqLVthp+pw at mail.gmail.com>
> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> >>>
> >>> Thanks Paul Oliver,
> >>>
> >>> I went through your presentation several times before.
> >>> I must say that It is very convincing and inspiring as well.
> >>>
> >>> Regarding the continous feed concept, I think it is a trade-off.
> >>> One one side, we will tell the users all the pros anc cons and let them
> >>> decide to choose what they like.
> >>> In this case, we will leave several different options for the users by a
> >>> field test of different gasifier models.
> >>> The user will tell. At this development stage of the continuous gasifier,
> >>> I
> >>> can't tell which (batch or continuous) suits the user most. Especially,
> >>> there is no one-size-fits-all solution
> >>>
> >>> Best regards,
> >>>
> >>> Tuong
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 10:12 AM, Paul Olivier <paul.olivier at esrla.com
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> The moment one goes from batch to continuous, the process gets really
> >>>> complicated. Nothing beats the simplicity of a static batch reactor.
> >>>> It provides ideal gasification conditions. The problem regarding the
> >>>> length of the batch cycle can be overcome if the fuel is densified. If
> >>>> the reactor is filled with pellets, the length of the cycle can be
> >>>> extended to well over five hours. Imagine: for a five full hours, the
> >>>> operator does not have to intervene. There is no loading of rice hulls
> >>>> or scrapping out of biochar during this entire period.
> >>> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/22013094/Paper/Presentations/Gasification.ppsx
> >>>> The time to empty, reload and relight a batch reactor is less than one
> >>>> minute.
> >>>> Several reactor tubes can be operated at the same time.
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks.
> >>>> Paul Olivier
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 8:23 AM, Tuong DoDuc
> >>>> <tuong.do at devi-renewable.com> wrote:
> >>>>> Dear Dr.TLUD, Paul Oliver, and others,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The team in SNV Vietnam is adopting the continous gasifier model
> >>>> developed
> >>>>> by Belonio. The manual has been obtained from the CRHET.
> >>>>> Watch our first propotype: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQGS-VQIj5M
> >>>>> We were able to control the fire, load fuel without affecting the
> >>> fire,
> >>>> and
> >>>>> easily remove char at the bottom of the reactor.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> We also adopted the computer fan-casing by a cheaper, more popular
> >>> fan in
> >>>>> Vietnam (often used for coal and fixed wood stove). Fan costed 2USD
> >>>> (while
> >>>>> to replicate Belonio's fan-casing, we bought the adapter for 5USD and
> >>> a
> >>>>> computer fan for 1.5USD)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> However, this is just our first step and we still have so many
> >>> problems
> >>>> to
> >>>>> fully control the fire and ease the operation.
> >>>>> 1) For instance, uncontrolled moment happened when combustion occurs
> >>>> rigt on
> >>>>> top of the fuel hopper, a lot of smoke was produced and later the fire
> >>>> burnt
> >>>>> the fan.
> >>>>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/43fkjs0axuye4oj/uncontrollable_moment.jpg
> >>>>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/rd1g1cg0a9ue8qt/fan_casing.jpg
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 2) Another problem is that a lot of tar is produced. It deposits on
> >>> pot
> >>>>> bottom, burner and other part of the stove. That would also harm the
> >>>> user.
> >>>>> An idea is to create a layer of char in the burner pipe (to filter the
> >>>> tar).
> >>>>> Not tried yet.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 3) We observes 5-10% of the gas leaked out through the char removal
> >>>> door. We
> >>>>> burnt them, but user may not know (or they simply just don't care)
> >>> that
> >>>> it
> >>>>> is toxic.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 4) One more, it is very hard to control the final minutes of the
> >>>>> gasificatoin process. It always cause inverted combustion to the fuel
> >>>>> hopper.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> By this email, I would like to ask if some of you have done similar
> >>> work
> >>>>> with continuous gasifier like this to share more experience. We can
> >>> thus
> >>>>> reduce our time and effort in localizing this technology.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Best regards,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Do Duc Tuong,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Renewable Energy Advisor
> >>>>> SNV Vietnam
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>>>
> >>>>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>>>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>>
> >>>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>>
> >>>>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web
> >>> site:
> >>>>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Paul A. Olivier PhD
> >>>> 26/5 Phu Dong Thien Vuong
> >>>> Dalat
> >>>> Vietnam
> >>>>
> >>>> Louisiana telephone: 1-337-447-4124 (rings Vietnam)
> >>>> Mobile: 090-694-1573 (in Vietnam)
> >>>> Skype address: Xpolivier
> >>>> http://www.esrla.com/
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>>
> >>>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>> -------------- next part --------------
> >>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >>> URL: <
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/9182fc38/attachment-0001.html
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> Message: 8
> >>> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 16:39:47 +0530
> >>> From: Nariphaltan <nariphaltan at gmail.com>
> >>> To: "rongretlarson at comcast.net" <rongretlarson at comcast.net>
> >>> Cc: Biochar-production <Biochar-production at yahoogroups.com>,
> >>> Discussion of biomass cooking stoves <
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>> Message-ID: <B08F79A0-7233-4B92-A188-A7C5BA79BB21 at gmail.com>
> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> >>>
> >>> Dear Ron,
> >>>
> >>> Thanks for your mail. We did this work when very few people were
> >>> interested in loose leafy gasifier. It was designed so that the flow is
> >>> smooth and hence the best strategy was to pyrolyse the biomass rather than
> >>> gasify it. In the process we also generated 25% char (w/w feed basis).
> >>> Since we are an agricultural research Institute hence we thought of using
> >>> this char as a soil conditioner. This was in 1990-1992. Because of the
> >>> pioneer nature of this work the gasifier together with the char in the
> >>> field was on cover of International Journal of Biomass Energy (David Hall
> >>> used to be the editor of the Journal).
> >>>
> >>> Why we left this work? This is a long story but we moved on to other
> >>> things and partly because no body was interested in the biomass research at
> >>> that time.
> >>>
> >>> Still I think Our work can be inspiration to lots of people.
> >>>
> >>> All the best.
> >>>
> >>> Anil
> >>>
> >>> Anil K Rajvanshi
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPad
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On 14-May-2013, at 8:25 AM, rongretlarson at comcast.net wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Dr. Rajvanshi: cc stoves and adding "bochar-production"
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks for sending us this report. A few questions
> >>>>
> >>>> a. This work was done in the mid '90's. What has happened recently
> >>> with this or similar equipment in India or your part of India? Can one
> >>> now buy such hardware?
> >>>>
> >>>> b. What caused NARI to design a pyrolyzer rather than a combustor?
> >>>>
> >>>> c. In the Abstract, you said the char "....can be used as a soil
> >>> conditioner." This would have been very early in the history of what we
> >>> now call "biochar". Was there then a market near Phaltan for such? Now?
> >>>>
> >>>> d. Your economics section does not show a price for char. Can you
> >>> guesstimate the relative value then and now for the char?
> >>>>
> >>>> Congratulations for what appears to have been a successful design
> >>> - ahead of its time..
> >>>>
> >>>> Ron
> >>>>
> >>>> From: "Nariphaltan" <nariphaltan at gmail.com>
> >>>> To: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>>> Cc: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>>> Sent: Monday, May 13, 2013 6:08:24 PM
> >>>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>>>
> >>>> Have a look at this "char making machine".
> >>> www.nariphaltan.org/Gasifier.pdf
> >>>>
> >>>> Cheers.
> >>>>
> >>>> Anil K Rajvanshi
> >>>>
> >>>> Sent from my iPad
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On 13-May-2013, at 11:24 PM, "Frank Shields" <frank at compostlab.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Stovers,
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Seems there is often a lot of wasted energy that could be used when
> >>> making char that is just flared off.
> >>>> I?m thinking the reason is that to convert to electricity one needs 1)
> >>> a very clean syngas 2) an expensive motor and 3) costly up-keep. The
> >>> generator is a onetime purchase with low maintenance.
> >>>>
> >>>> So why not use a steam engine to convert the flame to electricity?
> >>> Perhaps not as efficient but all you are doing is heating water so the gas
> >>> need not be as clean as when drawn into an internal combustion engine.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Frank
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks
> >>>>
> >>>> Frank Shields
> >>>>
> >>>> BioChar Division
> >>>> Control Laboratories, Inc.
> >>>> 42 Hangar Way
> >>>> Watsonville, CE 95076
> >>>>
> >>>> (831) 724-5422 tel
> >>>> (81) 724-3188 fax
> >>>> frank at biocharlab.com
> >>>> www.controllabs.com
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>>
> >>>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>>
> >>>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>>
> >>>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>> -------------- next part --------------
> >>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >>> URL: <
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/88a3f211/attachment-0001.html
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> Message: 9
> >>> Date: Tue, 14 May 2013 07:56:44 -0700
> >>> From: "Tom Miles" <tmiles at trmiles.com>
> >>> To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'"
> >>> <stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>, <
> >>> rongretlarson at comcast.net>
> >>> Cc: 'Biochar-production' <Biochar-production at yahoogroups.com>
> >>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>> Message-ID: <00a301ce50b3$40e683e0$c2b38ba0$@trmiles.com>
> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> >>>
> >>> Anil,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Thanks for bringing this out.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> At the time (1975-1995) there were efforts to convert straws and crop
> >>> residues to energy, particularly in France (at AFME, CEMAGREF, Pillard,
> >>> etc.). In most cases the char was considered a potential domestic fuel
> >>> rather than for agriculture. European demand for charcoal was high. French
> >>> wood pyrolysis and gasification plants were still in operation and in
> >>> development. (The downdraft gasifier that we associate with Hitler was
> >>> invented in France in the 1930s.)
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> As you remember David Hall made a concerted effort to improve
> >>> carbonization and energy systems in agriculture.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Tom
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> From: Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org] On Behalf
> >>> Of Nariphaltan
> >>> Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 4:10 AM
> >>> To: rongretlarson at comcast.net
> >>> Cc: Biochar-production; Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
> >>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Dear Ron,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Thanks for your mail. We did this work when very few people were
> >>> interested in loose leafy gasifier. It was designed so that the flow is
> >>> smooth and hence the best strategy was to pyrolyse the biomass rather than
> >>> gasify it. In the process we also generated 25% char (w/w feed basis).
> >>> Since we are an agricultural research Institute hence we thought of using
> >>> this char as a soil conditioner. This was in 1990-1992. Because of the
> >>> pioneer nature of this work the gasifier together with the char in the
> >>> field was on cover of International Journal of Biomass Energy (David Hall
> >>> used to be the editor of the Journal).
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Why we left this work? This is a long story but we moved on to other
> >>> things and partly because no body was interested in the biomass research at
> >>> that time.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Still I think Our work can be inspiration to lots of people.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> All the best.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Anil
> >>>
> >>> Anil K Rajvanshi
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPad
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On 14-May-2013, at 8:25 AM, rongretlarson at comcast.net wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Dr. Rajvanshi: cc stoves and adding "bochar-production"
> >>>
> >>> Thanks for sending us this report. A few questions
> >>>
> >>> a. This work was done in the mid '90's. What has happened recently with
> >>> this or similar equipment in India or your part of India? Can one now buy
> >>> such hardware?
> >>>
> >>> b. What caused NARI to design a pyrolyzer rather than a combustor?
> >>>
> >>> c. In the Abstract, you said the char "....can be used as a soil
> >>> conditioner." This would have been very early in the history of what we
> >>> now call "biochar". Was there then a market near Phaltan for such? Now?
> >>>
> >>> d. Your economics section does not show a price for char. Can you
> >>> guesstimate the relative value then and now for the char?
> >>>
> >>> Congratulations for what appears to have been a successful design -
> >>> ahead of its time..
> >>>
> >>> Ron
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _____
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> From: "Nariphaltan" <nariphaltan at gmail.com>
> >>> To: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>> Cc: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> >>> Sent: Monday, May 13, 2013 6:08:24 PM
> >>> Subject: Re: [Stoves] Using all the energy when char making
> >>>
> >>> Have a look at this "char making machine".
> >>> www.nariphaltan.org/Gasifier.pdf
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Cheers.
> >>>
> >>> Anil K Rajvanshi
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPad
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On 13-May-2013, at 11:24 PM, "Frank Shields" <frank at compostlab.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Stovers,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Seems there is often a lot of wasted energy that could be used when
> >>> making char that is just flared off.
> >>>
> >>> I?m thinking the reason is that to convert to electricity one needs 1) a
> >>> very clean syngas 2) an expensive motor and 3) costly up-keep. The
> >>> generator is a onetime purchase with low maintenance.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> So why not use a steam engine to convert the flame to electricity?
> >>> Perhaps not as efficient but all you are doing is heating water so the gas
> >>> need not be as clean as when drawn into an internal combustion engine.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Thanks
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Frank
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Thanks
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Frank Shields
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> BioChar Division
> >>>
> >>> Control Laboratories, Inc.
> >>>
> >>> 42 Hangar Way
> >>>
> >>> Watsonville, CE 95076
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> (831) 724-5422 tel
> >>>
> >>> (81) 724-3188 fax
> >>>
> >>> frank at biocharlab.com
> >>>
> >>> www.controllabs.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>
> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>>
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>
> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>>
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> >>>
> >>> -------------- next part --------------
> >>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >>> URL: <
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/67811ee2/attachment.html
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> Subject: Digest Footer
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Stoves mailing list
> >>>
> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >>> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>>
> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >>> http://www.bioenergylists.org/
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> End of Stoves Digest, Vol 33, Issue 18
> >>> **************************************
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Art Donnelly
> >> President SeaChar.Org
> >> US Director, The Farm Stove Project
> >> Proyecto Estufa Finca
> >>
> >> <http://email2.globalgiving.org/wf/click?c=1Oy%2FmZbgIyjS5WI580KXwShvfKBcF2eaJvtN7Pi6p7Jl%2FiR4938EMMCBwY%2FuYALeA%2BQYUWN4RpvnxBsBC7e2%2BGIHcONTozBmvsUU5LTL%2FTNk4Q3vxE%2BKdXTV2cxIsFplSPh%2F9nMG3bQMQf4bz9ZK9SHMy46Z8OPLAtMAnPG9SKkPuLCWvofBTLC%2BImqax%2BZTkkF2RvDri5UdgH19NHjHOBj5WMUrS4L62Z2xxUJbBsJdDUOfeifheNFXH546Xm0yul4P2stm%2FTUOJxYnI0nFjXEaYfzxDSc%2FwgqVkR1t0USDHk30%2Fgt9UpDpyzLj37HWtnNQ0q8Jh1gZCkB4Y1Fgbg394gYFkyNqFN4MchxO2Js%3D&rp=wrhiOr2wAxUyDMDlMSqbOkKa0FpPoiCSHffb%2ByfHGClRxIFjEIrUDwAF%2BFD%2BpAPuvam9BDwvSMcadhFv7aFwKoyAXYrFk00%2B92xPIeMHXaTDJ3x0VIj6ZYwjm1win65o&up=YDTqBOjidbCUo%2Far1oAtZjp5ji73zPEvmoO14mevuXzIDUdb6Ac9W13SPOXmzL5NflZkH0HxLp0v4dT9UwEHDV0wSZ1qusv09bIKkUliWs4%3D&u=LHuflw_1TAib_lgCu2JvQw%2Fh0>
> >> "SeaChar.Org...positive tools for carbon negative living"
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Stoves mailing list
> >>
> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> >> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> >>
> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >>
> >> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> >> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
> > -------------- next part --------------
> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> > URL: <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130514/d5cf21c4/attachment-0001.html>
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Subject: Digest Footer
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Stoves mailing list
> >
> > to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> > stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
> >
> > to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> > http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
> >
> >
> > for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> > http://www.bioenergylists.org/
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > End of Stoves Digest, Vol 33, Issue 19
> > **************************************
>
> _______________________________________________
> Stoves mailing list
>
> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address
> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org
>
> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page
> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org
>
> for more Biomass Cooking Stoves, News and Information see our web site:
> http://stoves.bioenergylists.org/
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/stoves_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20130517/cf3a0af6/attachment.html>
More information about the Stoves
mailing list