[Stoves] Guatemala meeting about tests and standards

Paul Anderson psanders at ilstu.edu
Sun Nov 23 23:06:21 CST 2014


Leslie     ( and to all),

I sincerely thank you for pointing out that a report about the Guatemala 
meeting is in the newsletter and blogsite.   One sentence in particular 
stands out:
> Thus, even though the IWA will likely be replaced by new standards in 
> the future, we need to continue to use the IWA in the interim to 
> maintain our momentum. 
Fair enough.  Crispin's comments were a bit more forceful.   Those of us 
who have stoves that are being tested are certainly concerned about what 
is developing.   We will need to see what transpires.

The posting as a blog was indeed timely, and in that way the 
communications are good.   I commend Ranyee and others for that. But I 
believe that too many postings go unnoticed, whether those by GACC or WB 
or other websites.   I know that I am guilty of not following closely 
all such postings.

On the other hand, the Stoves Listserv is a major communication avenue 
that is _under_utilized by GACC and WB and others as a way to alert 
people about what is happening.   I note that HEDON network does an 
excellent job of getting its items to the attention of the Stover 
community that is on the Stoves Listserv.

A case in point is the announcement of the availability of receiving 
LIVE transmission of the GACC Stove summit 3 days ago. A short note to 
the Stoves Listserv mentioning that availability (and give a link to the 
GACC site with details for joining the event) might have increased the 
number of on-line attendees.    (I saw the number was 45 at one point, 
and maybe higher later, but possibly much higher if notification to the 
Stoves Listserv had taken place.)

I certainly am not claiming to be typical of all the Stove Listserv 
subscribers.   I am just encouraging the GACC to send more messages and 
notifications.   And we are pleased to note that the GACC leadership is 
among the subscribers and actual readers of the Stoves Listserv.

Paul

Doc  /  Dr TLUD  /  Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
Email:  psanders at ilstu.edu
Skype: paultlud      Phone: +1-309-452-7072
Website:  www.drtlud.com

On 11/23/2014 8:23 PM, Leslie Cordes wrote:
> Paul - I want to make sure that you and others have had a chance to 
> read the overview from the Guatemala workshop that was posted on both 
> the Alliance web page (mid October) and sent out in the October 
> Alliance newsletter?  The link may be found here:
>
> http://www.cleancookstoves.org/blog/progress-report-october-2014.html
>
> Best,
>
> Leslie
>
> On Nov 23, 2014, at 4:16 PM, "Paul Anderson" <psanders at ilstu.edu 
> <mailto:psanders at ilstu.edu>> wrote:
>
>> Crispin and all,
>>
>> Thank you for your comments.   I EXPECT that others who attended, 
>> especially those in leadership roles, will also make comments.   I 
>> make three short comments:
>>
>> 1.  No tears for no tiers!!!!   I am not against measurements and 
>> making comparison (which should continue), but the rigor of what was 
>> implied in the Tiers structure seemed overbearing.
>>
>> 2.  The possible (actual?) demise of the WBT (as a strictly defined 
>> methodology) should result in some improvements.   We will continue 
>> to boil water (thank goodness at least water is rather standardized 
>> around the world), but without the precise regulations imposed over 
>> the past years.   There will be tests with boiling of water, but not 
>> a specific Water Boiling Test (note the capital letters in the name 
>> of some specific test).   How does this impact the use of prior 
>> results and change what we will do in the future?
>>
>> 3.  And most important:   Why is it that only now near the end of 
>> November is there any of this information becoming available?   I am 
>> thankfully NOT on any of the testing protocol committees, so I do not 
>> have first hand information.   But I AM extremely interested in what 
>> is happening because it impacts my work and the work of so many other 
>> Stovers.
>>
>> I am sure that Crispin is not making up what he wrote about the 
>> results from the Guatemala meeting.   It just seems that BIG news 
>> travels very slowly.
>>
>> I assume that the issues of tests and standards will be important 
>> topics on this Listserv, and that gatherings at ETHOS and at any 
>> workshops at the Regional Testing Centers will focus on such changes 
>> / variations.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>> Doc  /  Dr TLUD  /  Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
>> Email: psanders at ilstu.edu <mailto:psanders at ilstu.edu>
>> Skype: paultlud      Phone: +1-309-452-7072
>> Website: www.drtlud.com <http://www.drtlud.com>
>>
>> On 11/22/2014 3:19 PM, Crispin Pemberton-Pigott wrote:
>>> Dear Paul
>>>
>>> I asked SABS (South African Bureau of Standards) staff (who I 
>>> represent) if
>>> we are allowed to make documents like the new work item proposals and
>>> minutes available to non-members, meaning people outside the national
>>> committees. They said generally no, those are documents accessible 
>>> to the
>>> national standards bodies only (and their committee members).
>>>
>>> On the other hand there is a lot of interest on what is happening. I can
>>> report personally that several discussions were held on what 'shape' the
>>> future standard should have (tiers or not, for example) and the decision
>>> came down on the side of 'no tiers'. With respect to the WBT (the 
>>> GACC is
>>> presently the custodian of it) this was also turned down. The 
>>> preference is
>>> for a testing framework - first proposed in Nairobi and discussed in 
>>> some
>>> detail in Guatemala. The reasoning is that there are so many different
>>> environments in which stoves are used, it is not possible to imagine a
>>> single, rigid test that will helpful rate performance in all 
>>> nations. What
>>> needed, it was agreed, is a testing framework with valid sub-tests 
>>> which can
>>> be used if appropriate for the fuel, device or circumstances.
>>>
>>> This is already widely done in other industries. Building energy 
>>> efficiency
>>> is one example, and all the social sciences. The same applies in the EU
>>> where a single omnibus standard applies to a huge range of cooking
>>> appliances. So it is a matter of keeping up, not reinventing the wheel.
>>>
>>> In terms of attendance, a lot of people had trouble getting visas to
>>> Guatemala. The total was about 65. That was for 4 Working Groups. 
>>> Only two
>>> met at a time and all were invited to attend anything of interest. As a
>>> percentage, there were more people with some standards background 
>>> than in
>>> Nairobi. We saw some new faces.
>>>
>>> Regard
>>> Crispin
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces at lists.bioenergylists.org] On 
>>> Behalf Of
>>> Paul Anderson
>>> Sent: Friday, November 21, 2014 7:29 PM
>>> To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
>>> Subject: [Stoves] Guatemala meeting about tests and standards
>>>
>>> Dear Stovers,
>>>
>>> There was a meeting about tests and standards of stoves in Guatemala a
>>> month or so ago.   Is there any summary report?  Or could those who were
>>> there make some comments, please.
>>>
>>> I assume there is a list somewhere of who are on the ISO / WBT / IWA /
>>> XYZ committee.   And how many showed up?
>>>
>>> Nothing was said about this at the GACC 2 day meeting just 
>>> concluded, so I
>>> thought I would ask.
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance,
>>>
>>> Paul
>>>
>>> --
>>> Doc  /  Dr TLUD  /  Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
>>> Email: psanders at ilstu.edu <mailto:psanders at ilstu.edu>
>>> Skype: paultlud      Phone: +1-309-452-7072
>>> Website: www.drtlud.com <http://www.drtlud.com>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Stoves mailing list
>>>
>>
>>
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