[Stoves] TLUD stoves for Guatemala .... Re: How Results Based Financing is spurring solar market development in Tanzania

Paul Anderson psanders at ilstu.edu
Tue Mar 3 23:54:19 CST 2015


Christina Espinosa wrote:
> Ihope so! My favorite bio-mass stoves are TLUDs!! If anyone would like 
> me to test some here with women just let me know and we can let you 
> know what the consumers think.
  I would like to assist to make this happen.   I do not have any 
manufacturing capabilities in Guatemala.   We would need to discuss and 
collaborate on having some TLUD stoves (in an appropriate configuration) 
made in Guatemala.     For a few trial TLUD stoves, the closest person 
with TLUD production experience is Gustavo Pen~a in Sonsonate, El 
Salvador.    We would need the help from Christina to arrange for a 
supplier.

For a simple TLUD for pot cooking (not plancha cooking at the start), I 
would like to have shown to the people the Troika Bingwa (mean Champion, 
or Campeo'n in Spanish), seen at www.drtlud.com But it can be modified 
for the Guatemala situations.

Christina, in what environmental settings are you working with stoves?   
rural, peri-urban, urban, far-remote;    higher elevations, coastal 
lowlands?;   etc.    And arevyour testing activities for a limited time, 
or are you permanently working in the area?

I hope that this can develop nicely!!!

Paul

Doc  /  Dr TLUD  /  Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD
Email:  psanders at ilstu.edu
Skype: paultlud      Phone: +1-309-452-7072
Website:  www.drtlud.com

On 3/3/2015 2:30 PM, Christina Espinosa wrote:
> Hi Ron!
>
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 11:18 PM, Ronal W. Larson 
> <rongretlarson at comcast.net <mailto:rongretlarson at comcast.net>> wrote:
>
>     Christina:   (cc list)
>
>     I believe you are the first person to be advocating LPG on this
>     list.  Your vision is receiving support from some important actors
>     in stove development.  I can easily conceive that you have a
>     system that no biomass stove can compete with -  mostly on the
>     basis of emissions and human health, but also probably on saving
>     time while cooking.
>
>     But I am confused about some messages I hear about LPG.
>
>     a.   I have hear of safety issues with LPG.  Any data on safety?
>
>
> I am not an expert on safety data, but the data will probably vary 
> considerably by country. Typically there are two reasons for bad 
> safety images: 1) lack of maintenance to LPG cilinders and lack of 
> regulation to industry, and 2) consumer misuse (consumers flipping 
> cylinders, etc).
>
> We developed an safety education around using LPG for Guatemala.
>
> There is a cool study that they are working on about burns in India 
> (LPG, kerosene, and wood). I don't think it has been published yet.
>
>
>     b. I know nothing about the cost of LPG stoves or fuel.  Can you
>     tell us the price of your stove (and the storage can) and the cost
>     of LPG fuel (sold by weight?)  Does Guatemala subsidize LPG prices?
>
>
> Great questions. Remember every market will have extremely different 
> prices, regulations, etc. Guatemala is a perfect market to test 
> something like LPG, since the infrastructure is already built.
>
> We just completed 2,741 surveys in two communities here in Guatemala 
> here are some of the data to put it into perspective:
>
> -76% of families have interest in switching to LPG
> -73% of families interested in switching are purchasing wood
> -65% of the families interested in using LPG, purchase wood in large 
> quantities ($32.78 per tarea)
> -51% of families use a "tercio" (26 wood sticks, more or less $2) of 
> wood to cook daily, 45% use a "manojo" (10 wood sticks, $1.30) of wood 
> to cook daily
> -Families use an average of 1.35 of a "tarea" every month to cook 
> ($44.25 a month in wood fuel).
>
> Families in Guatemala depending on size use a 25lb tank on average 
> every month. If they use both wood and LPG typically purchase LPG 
> every 2 months. A 25lb tank refill currently costs $12.06 (the most 
> expensive at $18.35)
>
> LPG is not subsidized in Guatemala.
>
> We currently offer 6 different stove models. We are not manufactures, 
> but distribute stoves that our local consumers are wishing to 
> purchase. Our complete stove packages range from $75-$300 (stove, 
> tank, regulator, reinforced tubing, pressure cookers(optional)). We 
> offer credit plans from 3-36 months with a local bank. We also 
> distribute LPG, since the market has an inventory of LPG tanks in bad 
> shape, it helps new consumers in terms of safety and quality of the 
> tank they receive in the household.
>
>
>     c.   Could you give us some basis for comparing with prices in
>     Guatemala for wood (sticks, chips, pellets) fuel? if you have
>     these (and LPG) prices on an MJ or per standard meal or day basis,
>     that would be helpful.
>
> See above.
>
>     d. Because of the highly superior emissions characteristics (I
>     understood how good for the first time at the ETHOS conference),
>      I could get behind LPG stoves if that fuel was biomass-based -
>     and even more so if the fuel came with a co-product char  (my
>     reasons for supporting char-making stove development).  Do you (or
>     anyone) know of anyone working on a bio-LPG?  (and one with a char
>     co-product?)
>
>     Googling gave me this site:
>     http://www.biomass-asia-workshop.jp/biomassws/09workshop/jp/full/16fujimoto.pdf,
>     showing use of a CO-H2 syngas as one approach.
>     and also from Japan
>     http://www.ieatask33.org/app/webroot/files/file/2012/IEA%20Bioenergy%20Conference/SessionI4-Ogi.pdf
>     and this one seems pretty well done;
>     http://www.propanecouncil.org/uploadedFiles/Council/Research_and_Development/New_research_programs/Fuel_Parameters_and_Analysis/REP_15866%20Expert%20Analysis%20of%20Biopropane.pdf
>     and there are more cites - but I think that there may now be zero
>     bio-LPG.
>
>     None of these mention char - maybe the Cool Planet approach to a
>     bio-gasoline can be modified.
>
>
> I am not familiar with any of these but there is constantly new 
> technology that is being developed within the LPG industry. LPG is a 
> fossil fuel, but its a use it or lose it by-product. The industry is 
> supportive of transitioning families to LPG but there are very few 
> initiatives addressing it. The World LP Gas Association launched a 
> Cooking for Life campaign. http://www.cooking-for-life.org/
>
>     e. Does LPG fuel in Guatemala come with a well-defined
>     (controlled, certified) mix of propane and butane?
>
>     Thanks in advance for any more of a sales pitch for LPG that you
>     can provide.  (Your web site http://gentegas.com/ is very well done.)
>
>
> The industry here is supposed to have a regulated mix of propane and 
> butane, but every LPG company varies a bit. Again the industry has 
> little regulation.
>
>
>     f.  I wonder if any TLUD proponent believes we can ever achieve a
>     TLUD stove as healthy as the LPG variety?  (fans/blowers
>     permitted).  Or sufficiently low emission to allow TLUD/fan stoves
>     to compete on a health basis with LPG?   Same question for rockets.
>
>
> Ihope so! My favorite bio-mass stoves are TLUDs!! If anyone would like 
> me to test some here with women just let me know and we can let you 
> know what the consumers think.
>
>
>     Ron
>
>

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