[Stoves] [dd-toronto] Drawdown related project

Sat Jan 18 00:05:03 CST 2020

See comment below.

On Sat, Jan 18, 2020 at 11:42 AM Lloyd Helferty <lhelferty at gmail.com> wrote:

> Thanks, Paul.
>
>   You have just reinforced my point that the best "intervention" is simply
> to show people various "alternative" ways of cooking (including imparting
> the "smoky flavours" that they love) ... and then simply demonstrating and
> teaching them how to use the new stoves (to achieve what they want,
> including getting the *flavours* they want).
>

I suggest that special pellets be used when grilling meat.
The wood used to make the pellets should impart flavor (for example,
mesquite).

>  Of course the "alternative solutions" [i.e. the "clean" cookstoves] need
> to be as easy to use (or easier)
>
I found an easy way to light pellets within the reactor.
A small layer of pine shavings are placed above the pellets.
Then a stainless steel wire mesh disk is placed above the pine shavings.
A small gas torch is directed down onto the wire mesh.
When the disk turns red hot and emits radiant heat onto the pine shavings,
the shavings light within a matter of seconds.
The shavings then light the pellets.
In this way, no smoke is created.

When the burner with tungsten disk is placed on top of the reactor, the
same gas torch is directed down onto the tungsten disk.
The tungsten gets red hot and lights the syngas.
No matches, paper or cardboard have to be used to light pellets or syngas.

Both the stainless steel wire mesh and the tungsten disk prevent the escape
of particulate matter.
They also burn up oily compounds.

[image: image.jpeg]

> and, ideally, as inexpensive as the "traditional" cooking methods [and/or
> where they can be shown that there are some "savings" on fuel *cost*
>
There is no fuel cost.
Instead there is a fuel profit, since the biochar produced has a higher
value than the biomass from which it is derived.
There is an endless supply of agricultural and forestry debris that can be
used to make pellets.
We hope to sell the 150-250 gasifier, with a run time on pellets of 1.25
hours, for about $50 USD.
We use 304 stainless steel in making all parts of the gasifier.

Thanks.
Paul

> ~ or where the new stove uses easily *accessible* 'fuels'] ... or, if
> they can be shown ways of making some (possibly even small) *additional
> income* from using the new stoves.
>
> Regards,
>
> Lloyd Helferty, Engineering Technologist
> Principal, Biochar Consulting (Canada)
> System Leader and Sector Expert for the "Climate Smart" Platform
>   & Project Development Director
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> "The best way to predict the future is to create it." - Willy Brandt
>
> On 2020-01-17 9:42 PM, Paul Olivier wrote:
>
> Lloyd,
>
> Barbecue fumes are highly toxic.
> There are other ways to impart wood flavor to meat.
> After sous vide cooking with gasifier heat, meat can be grilled using
> gasifier heat.
> A grill pan can be used.
> [image: image.jpeg]
>
> Thanks.
> Paul
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 18, 2020 at 3:48 AM Lloyd Helferty wrote:
>
>> Hello all,
>>
>>   FYI, I have also been involved in these Clean Cookstove conversations
>> for many years -- through the "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves", which
>> is a *global* conversation.
>>
>>  I agree with Peter: "imposition of so-called *better technology* comes
>> across as a *colonization* of long-standing and well-adapted cooking
>> practices".
>>
>>   *Cultural context* matters -- a lot!
>>
>>  Any "interventions" should only be done if it is *REQUESTED by the
>> community itself*... otherwise attempts at "imposing" solutions will
>> very likely be simply abandoned after a very short period of time ~
>> especially if the (imposed) "Solution(s)" end up being more costly or
>> complex than the existing methods.
>>
>>  The most likely "intervention" method would simply be to go to these
>> communities, show them various "alternative" ways of cooking (such as by
>> pelleting and/or using certain types of "waste" that may be readily
>> available in those communities -- such as *rice husks* in Vietnam -- and
>> which can be used in alternative clean cookstoves that behave very much
>> like modern [gas] cookstoves, and then simply demonstrate and teach them
>> how to use the new stoves.
>>
>>  Beyond that you can't "force" them to change anything... especially if
>> their diets include cooked foods that get much of their flavour from smoke
>> and charcoal etc.
>>
>>  It would be like asking a guy who loves *Smoked Meat* to "stop using
>> wood"!
>>
>> [image: Lang Reverse Flow Wood Smoker - Yelp]
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Lloyd Helferty
>>
>> On 2020-01-12 3:20 PM, David Burman wrote:
>>
>> along those lines, when the Cuban government supplied electric hotplates
>> to all households (along with compact fluorescent lightbulbs) they all
>> collapsed.
>>
>> Why? because they were made in China and designed for use with woks and
>> not the pressure cookers used by Cubans. It became a national joke :)
>> On 1/12/2020 1:30 PM, Jones, Peter wrote:
>>
>> Clean cookstoves are a fascinating area of discussion in innovation
>> studies. With an ethnographic study of actual human practices, they quickly
>> show us the complexity in “making decisions for other cultures.”
>>
>> We have to step lightly in these issues because the *imposition of
>> so-called better technology comes across as a colonization of long-standing
>> and well-adapted cooking practices*. We have to be careful when “solving
>> problems for other cultures.”
>>
>>  My grad student William Georg conducted a nearly 3-month innovation
>> adoption study in Kampala, Uganda on clean cookstove adoption.
>> http://openresearch.ocadu.ca/id/eprint/351/  We presented this work at
>> the EPIC Ethnography conference in 2016. Ut is consistent with other
>> anthropological findings.
>>
>>  Simply put, for many indigenous and subsistence cultures, the use of
>> charcoal is well-adapted to their preferred and affordable cooking and
>> eating practices and preferences.  Indigenous cultures and slum-dwellers
>> are not likely candidates to change diet for the environment. They cook
>> indoors with charcoal and risk pulmonary disease for their whole families.
>> But cookstoves have been a failure in many – not all – locations because of
>> cultural practice, AND simple constraints – such as, many subsistence
>> diets, they cook beans or other simmering foods that use up liquid fuels
>> quickly. These stoves might double the cost of cooking beans. So even when
>> these stoves are given away, they often get used just for tea or quick
>> cooking.
>>
>>  So what to do? First of all, we should focus on our own culture first
>> and foremost. Second, pay attention to human sciences. It can become
>> complex and wasteful trying to intervene where we don’t understand
>> practices. Third, when designing solutions – when requested – for these
>> practices, we really must balance cost, end use, and the human cultural
>> practices that we have no right as westerners to change. We have to work
>> with people in their contexts, not ours.
>>
>>  All the best, Peter
>>
>>
>> *PETER JONES, PH.D. *ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR
>> FACULTY OF DESIGN
>>
>> *T  *416 799 8799      @redesign
>> *E*  pjones at ocadu.ca
>>
>> *Design Dialogues * <http://designdialogues.com/>
>> *Strategic Innovation Lab* <http://slab.ocadu.ca/>
>> *Systemic Design Association (RSD) * <https://systemic-design.net/>
>>
>>
>> * OCAD UNIVERSITY **Strategic Foresight & Innovation*
>> 205 Richmond St. West, Suite 410
>> Toronto, Canada  M5V 1V3
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* main at drawdown-toronto.groups.io *On Behalf Of *Lyn Adamson via
>> Groups.Io
>>
>>  I have heard of a group working on a clean cook stove project. I think
>> for Guatemala. Located in Lanark County. I have reached out to get more
>> info.
>>
>>  Lyn
>>
>>
>> On Jan 11, 2020, at 10:33 PM, David Burman wrote:
>>
>> We have the mailchimp list.
>>
>> Would need more info  before putting it out there.
>>
>> Talk Wednesday
>>
>> D
>>
>> Get BlueMail for Android <http://www.bluemail.me/r?b=15726>
>>
>> On Jan. 10, 2020, at 2:58 p.m., "Jonathan Love via Groups.Io" wrote:
>>
>> If we had some kind of directory I would say to put it there. But I don’t
>> think there’s much else we should do.
>>
>> Jon
>>
>> <Snip>
>

-- 
Paul A. Olivier PhD
27/2bis Phu Dong Thien Vuong
Dalat
Vietnam

Louisiana telephone: 1-337-447-4124 (rings Vietnam)
Mobile: 090-694-1573 (in Vietnam)
Skype address: Xpolivier
http://epwt.vn/en/home/
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