[Stoves] News: National Geographic on promotion of gas stoves over improved woodstoves - in Guatemala

[Nikhil Desai]

Xavier:

I still urge you to consider preparing a document on test metrics and
protocols that can be discussed in the open by ISO representatives and
technical experts worldwide. What is discussed behind closed doors where,
when and why shouldn't be your concern.

There are vested interests in testing protocols and product specifications
- which is why national standards organizations exist in the first place,
be it fuel analysis or nuclear reactors.

The discussion here has often attracted heat when you tried to shed light.
I might be one of those "rude" people, though I don't think I was
personally rude to anybody.

ISO standards are valid only as countries adopt them and can enforce them;
this is not possible in the US. However, there is a "grey market" for stove
design and dissemination that can run outside any formal recognition; after
all, much of biomass household stoves market is outside the realm of any
national regulations.

It is now CDM and Gold Standard Foundation in company of GACC that are
going after what I imagine to be a market for hundreds of billions of
dollars if solid fuels are to be eliminated from household cooking - SDG
3.9.1 - by 2035. (Roughly 2-3 btCO2e/y in CO2 and BC reductions depending
on 20- or 100-y GWPs and fNRB, whether BC is incorporated in CDM or SDGs or
NDC calculus; and roughly 30 b aDALYs/y assuming that a cookstove
intervention should aim to achieve at least 10 aDALYs per capita. Now,
these will be achieved and marketed gradually, the market shrinking in size
as "clean cooking interventions" take hold. My rough calculation for
theoretical cumulative market size over 18 years -- at least 20 btCO2e and
100 b aDALYs.)

A lot of money to be made, from benefits agreed to by experts. Let's see
how laws pan out.

I repeat, US claims to be a nation of laws. So US entities are bound by
legal agreements. GACC may be tested.

Nikhil




On Mon, Sep 4, 2017 at 6:06 PM, Xavier Brandao <xvr.brandao at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Dear Sally,
>
>
>
> Thanks for the clarification.
>
> In that case, it is not as easy to access and join to ISO TC 285 as it was
> previously declared.
>
>
>
> I then maintain that a conversation including all, any, interested party
> who wants to contribute to stove testing and protocols has to happen
> outside of the ISO.
>
>
>
> Best,
>
>
> Xavier
>
>
>
>
>
> *De :* Sally Seitz [mailto:SSeitz at ansi.org <SSeitz at ansi.org>]
> *Envoyé :* dimanche 3 septembre 2017 12:20
> *À :* 'Xavier Brandao'; ndesai at alum.mit.edu; 'Discussion of biomass
> cooking stoves'
> *Cc :* Dr. Ronal Larson; 'Crispin Pemberton-Pigott'; Neeraja Penumetcha
> *Objet :* RE: [Stoves] News: National Geographic on promotion of gas
> stoves over improved woodstoves - in Guatemala
>
>
>
> Hello everyone,
>
>
>
> I would like to point out that the presentation to which you refer was for
> the IWA which took place prior to the formation of ISO TC 285.  ISO rules
> are different for an IWA – any interested party may attend an IWA meeting
> and participation is not limited to National Member Bodies or liaison.  The
> rules are different for participation in ISO Technical and Subcommittees.
> Participation in ISO TCs and SCs is limited to National Bodies and liaison
> organizations, and participation includes both offering comments on drafts
> and attending meetings.
>
>
>
> I do hope this clarification helps.
>
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Sally
>
>
>
> *From:* Xavier Brandao [mailto:xvr.brandao at gmail.com
> <xvr.brandao at gmail.com>]
> *Sent:* Saturday, September 02, 2017 5:40 PM
> *To:* ndesai at alum.mit.edu; 'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves' <
> stoves at lists.bioenergylists.org>
> *Cc:* Dr. Ronal Larson <rongretlarson at comcast.net>; 'Crispin
> Pemberton-Pigott' <crispinpigott at outlook.com>; Neeraja Penumetcha <
> npenumetcha at cleancookstoves.org>; Sally Seitz <SSeitz at ansi.org>
> *Subject:* RE: [Stoves] News: National Geographic on promotion of gas
> stoves over improved woodstoves - in Guatemala
>
>
>
> Dear Nikhil,
>
>
>
> « Taking her word, what Ms. Seitz seems to be suggesting is that
> "opposition to substantial issues" can be expressed by "concerned
> interests", not necessarily limited to National Standards Bodies that
> participate in the ISO process, and that the ISO process at least has an
> obligation to seek to take into account (read that bureaucratese anywhich
> way you wish) "the views of all parties concerned). »
>
> OK, I didn’t know that, thanks for sharing the information, I’ll have a
> look at it.
>
>
>
> « I am afraid there is no "We".  Despite GACC and World Bank claims about
> "stove sector" or "improved and clean cooking sector", there is no official
> stamp on any testing protocol. »
>
> I am for cooperation rather than division. I think a lot can be worked out
> by discussion.
>
> Best,
>
>
> Xavier
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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